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Tuesday, March 10th, 2009SUGGEST NEWS

My New House (Bought Feb, 2009)
Posted by: Nebuchadnezzar on March 10th, 2009 @ 12:59PM

3/10 - We totally like the house. We managed to fit my car in the garage about a week or so ago. I took a picture. The other half of the garage is hotlikeme's boxes. She's decorated the kids rooms nicely. She has bought little things to make the house way better. She hung up curtains over the lame sliding door that didn't have any. We didn't like anyone being able to look on us if they got on our patio.

We got a key to one of our gates. Our other gate (to patio) can be locked with a non key latch from the inside. We want to add a remote doorbell and some key/door locks sometimes.

We went to the pool for the first time a couple of days ago. The pool is actually really warm,heated. It's SO close. If there was a path between the houses, it would be super close. You have to walk to the end of the driveway (short) and there it is. It's actually closer than the last apartment's pool.

You can also rent a garden at the end of the street for $10. We might sign up for that soon.

Also there's a MASSIVE park next door we found.

2/7 - Got my garage remote today. I need to get a second one. I'm not sure if you just go buy a generic one then reprogram it or something. I'm a total house newb.

Also still need keys to pool/gates.

2/6 - Agent says the house closed in escrow and they'll get us the keys. Yay. Now I just have to worry about paying back my initial costs.

Agent claims that Escrow Claims the loan is now funded and I'll get my keys. Also I might qualify for the $15,000 tax rebate. If you live in the house for 3 years, you don't have to repay it.

2/5 - I'm just so depressed about the whole situation. We don't even want to unpack anymore. We don't even know if the house we're living in is ours. Someone dropped off the key to the mailbox and we're wondering if that's because they want to mail us eviction notices.

The agent/broker are paying $75 a day for us to stay there. They said on Jan 29th when we started moving in that they were 99.9% sure the loan would fund on the 30th. Then delay after delay. Then earlier this week they said the President of GMAC said our loan would fund the next day (It didn't).

Will we have to move again? We had HotLikeMe's mom fly in from Oregon to help us for 5+ days. She's a director of HR. That doesn't come cheap. So we would have to move out to an apartment then?

The other talk is hey we'd have to put up another 0.5% of the loan downpayment (because I got 3% down for 2008 and in 2009 it's 3.5%) and a different interest rate. Or that we'd have to wait weeks for ANOTHER lender to take up the loan.

I've put $22,000 down and I owe $11,000 :(

WTF seriously. This shit only happens to me. I've got a lot of nice things in my life such as my JOB and my BABY but never wish to have another person's life. The grass is always greener on the other side.

I've also rolled under 10 out of 1-100 like 5 times in a row in WOW on raid items.

2/4 - Now they are saying because Escrow screwed up on a paper, they want to spend 2 days reviewing the loan again. We got info for a real estate attorney.

The loan is still not funded. It's been 46 days. A FHA loan typically takes longer but now it's even past that point. I paid these people like 7k$+ and they're giving a bunch of bs excuses for the delays such "Month end, lack of staffing by the funding entity, and a big mistake by Escrow." These people get all this money for just doing paperwork and they can't even do their jobs right.

Our agent said she'd make sure we don't get kicked out and that we can get another lender :(

2/3 - Update - This time the idiots at Escrow screwed up and the loan wasn't funded AGAIN today. It's already been almost 2 weeks since escrow got our money.

Original Post: They claim our loan will fund today. I bet the sellers are so mad by now. But that's what they get for forcing us to pick that specific broker.

2/2 - Overall we really like the new house. Here's some pros/cons

Pro

  • More space
  • We got an awesome stainless steel fridge at the Sears Outlet. It's like $900 when it's supposed to be like $1700+. It makes great crushed ice.
  • No one above or below or connected. There is a garage wall connected to my patio but what we do shouldn't affect the neighbor.
  • Neighbors have been super nice. Two came over to say hi.
  • More parking for guests. One day I parked 4 cars (Moving Truck + 2 our cars + 1 visitor).
  • We're at the end of a driveway that empties out to a big circle which you can play in since only 2 other houses use it.
  • There's no clear entrance to the place so people have no idea how to get into your house. You enter through a fence gate (not obvious) which goes to patio and then front door. The pizza guy managed to find us haha.
  • Garage is big and has a nice closet built in for storage of clothes.

    Con

  • Floors are this Vinyl fake wood floor. They HURT to walk on and are super dirty even after cleaning them. Our feet/socks are all black by the end of the day. I'd like to get some rugs or carpet it eventually in some areas.
  • Gate needs some sort of handle on the outside to lock it on both sides. I don't want anyone to just be able to walk onto my patio whenever they want (which they can).
  • Need some drapes in a few windows. People can just walk into my patio and then look into a sliding door to see into the living room. I want to at least get drapes for that. Also the bedroom is super bright in the morning due to the shades.
  • They converted a 2 bedroom into a 3 bedroom using a Den. We like the room. It's pretty small but is a great BABY sized room. BUT They never put a vent in that bedroom (baby's room) and the damn door doesn't even close because it doesn't fit. We need to fix the door. Eventually we hope to put a vent in.
  • They have lights in two locations which can dim, but if you dim them, the lights make this obnoxious humming sound. Someone said you can get better bulbs to fix that.
  • People smoke across the street and 2 houses down. The smell caries to our side.
  • The sun sets right into my garage. That is very annoying for me so far. I would have never thought to check that. I don't know if it's a deal breaker but it also aims into the bunnies too.

    2/2 - The cock sucking lender/broker still haven't closed the loan. We suspected they were going to try to stall until Feb to make more money somehow and that's exactly what they did. They claimed all sorts of bs reasons like end of the month and they fired 1/2 the people but in reality, they somehow profited by waiting until feb.

    The real estate agent sold us this broker based on him closing on time but he sure as fuck didn't close on time. He missed 2 dates. Also the seller blackmailed us into going with that broker saying they would pull out of the deal if we didn't use him. So they really fucked themselves by doing that. If we woulda went with Wells Fargo, they would have had their money by now.

    I hope to post more when I get internet again.
    1/29 - Got the house about 2 p.m. or so. Man some asshole let their dog shit in the garage. The sellers would not take it off the market until like a week before it closed so a ton of people were going through the place and it was SO dirty.

    2 neighbors already stopped by. There's a beautiful Asian lady across who said she lives with her dad and cousin. Man her house is way nicer, two story with a Mercedes AMG and another BMW. There's an old codger next door to us that is pretty friendly. Then there's a Korean family across with a few kids, that are the same age as our kid.

    1/29 - Hope to get the keys by 12. The agent is going to rent the place for a day or two before we close. Awesome.

    1/28 Update 2: Looks like we can rent the place out (from ourselves?) until the house is ours. So we hope to get the key tomorrow morning. I'm getting a truck and moving all day. Then next day some pro movers move some of the big things. I also have to move out of HotLikeMe's storage unit. Should be a big mess but hopefully I won't have to live at the bottom of a trash can someday when it's cleaned up.

    Update 1: The lender basically said they wouldn't fund it until a week later. They were the problem. We have a broker that went to a lender but I still blame the broker and will bad mouth them probably. Currently we're looking at maybe getting the place tomorrow if possible. Our agent has been super cool. The seller/lender have been jerks. The MAN seller is cool, his agent is a bizatch.

    1/28 - It's not the seller screwing us. It's the lender. We signed on Friday and sent our $ to escrow. Then the papers said 1/27 and here it is the 28th and no house. He gaveus some bs about it being the end of the month or something. We suspect something shady is going on. Everyone said this is unheard of. We might consult a lawyer.

    1/27 - Man they keep fucking me. I gave the money and signed the loan papers on Friday but now they say I can't get in until THIS Friday, a week later? We're trying to get that date modified. I was hoping to move Wed Night, all Thurs, most of Friday. We have a Fridge being installed on Thursday. HotLikeMe's mom is flying in Wednesday. Now we're being fucked. I'm furious. We got forced into this lender guy that is a good deal BUT we've seen a week delay, and now another week delay on top of that. If I can't get in until Friday then I'm really fucked for moving in. I need 1 day before the pro movers to get the general crap out of the way. I also need several days of cleanup. So I'd have to pay my apartment even longer to stay there. We're thinking just dump the shit on the patio if they won't let us in. haha.

    1/26 - Get the keys maybe Wednesday. I'm going to be moving Wed - Sunday. HotLikeMe's mom is coming to help her move her stuff.

    1/23 - We're supposed to sign the loan docs today. Just me I mean. The House is entirely mine. But she's done most of the work. She owns her own house + she has an accounting degree so she knows more about what is going on than me.

    1/20 - Our house is now going to close at the end of the month. HotLikeMe talked the apartment place down to $200 to stay longer. She got us a new fridge and we have to rent a truck to get it to the garage then, later get another truck to take it to the house. Lame.

    1/16 - I'm so mad. We were supposed to close today. Now we have no idea when we're supposed to close. It's going to cost $600 to stay ONE MORE WEEK at my apartment. They're ordering a SECOND appraisal now, and I sure don't feel like paying for that. We have a garage full of boxes because we were going to move.

    I spent like $75 to fax/fedex all these forms from Oregon and now I'm hearing I have to fill out ALL the new papers again. I'm so pissed.

    1/14 - Lame, closing date extended at least a week. I was going to move over the FREE Monday day off. :( I already started packing and have a bunch of boxes packed. Luckily I didn't take my stereo down. I almost did it.

    1/13 - Got the loan approved, I just need to get the papers and sign. Did the final inspection today. Some asshole went and took all of the UNRIPE oranges off the Orange tree. We're really disappointed about that. No one seemed to know why or who did it. :(

    It's hard to call it a house, it feels more like an apartment. No one is attached to us except there's a garage of a neighbor attached to the otherside of our patio. The "houses" all look alike though except those who have modified theres. I can't for the life of me even find the place, I keep turning down the wrong streets because every row of "houses" look alike. I finally found one stand out house on the corner to recognize so I know where to turn.

    We get to move in maybe starting Friday. There's a pool right next door a few feet, a tennis court is across the street too.

    It's not a huge place, about 1,300 sq feet but it's in one of the nicest areas and top 10 safest city in US. It's also right next door to work, I'll start biking.

    HOA

    It's a HOA place. I didn't want to do that and the fee is kinda high but HOA fees are almost always required in the city.

    On paper the HOA sounds kinda like dicks but in person they seem pretty nice. The only rules I don't like is that they won't let anyone but PEOPLE go on the sidewalks. It's not like you'd want your kids on the street on their scooters. Hopefully they don't enforce that one.

    Another rule I don't like is that to make a second story on your place you have to have neighbors that have one stories. That's the case now and we only have one neighbor but if they beat you to a second story, you can't do one on your own.

    1/4 - HotLikeMe is handling pretty much all of it. I just sign papers. She's an accountant and owns her own house besides this. She's doing a great job as far as I know.

    Fedexed and faxed some documents back to the lender and seller. Basically there's no way to back out now except on HOA docs (which I haven't seen). HOA fees are bs but for the town here, almost all of them have them. I do get a pool, gym, clubhouse for it.

    What's really pissing us off is they keep saying it's still for sale and showing it to people despite us being close to owning it. Apparently they won't take it down until they get one document from us. Pretty lame.

    I'm closing like a week or so after I get back to California. Then it's moving time.

    12/30 - We need to fax back our seller's disclosure report. We can't get it to print here and we have to go somewhere to fax everytime.

    The apartment complex told us they were going to remodel our place so we wouldn't need to pay a lease break, then they changed their mind on us. They wanted $2,300. Well we threatened to take them to small claims court. Then they magically came up with a better solution. They said they would go back to our lease signing and pretend we never signed it. Before, they wanted $3,000+ lease break fee.

    We're still trying to get papers to the loan broker to lock in our rate. Brokers are lame. The only way this is going to pay off if he locks in some lower rate.

    12/25 - All kinds of shady stuff going on. If things get too shady, I won't sign.

    12/23 - We ended up selecting a broker. He had 5% interest vs. higher for other people. He had like $1,500 more closing costs but overall the payment will be cheaper. Hopefully he doesn't put any hidden fees. He did give a good faith estimate. The seller is being a real mother fucker because they have lots of offers on the place. They gave us an ultimatum to select a lender by 5p.m. or they're out. I don't think they can really do that.

    Two of the Mortgage people that me or my family knew have since gone out of business in the last two weeks. Crazy.

    12/22 - Leaning toward Wells Fargo right now. We did look at Bank of A.

    We're looking for lenders on the house so any tips, let us know. We're going to go out looking today. I'm doing FHA so some places are no good for me.

    12/19 - We did a home inspection. Only a few things were wrong. I guess the water heater is leaking CO2. Now we have to find a good loan for the place. I printed out tons of documents needed to get a loan.

    Opened escrow today. Did home inspection today ($285). I have to buy it from Oregon. Gone.

    12/18 - I *THINK* we bought a house. They say they're looking into multiple offers but we're #1 in line. They wanted $10k in cash deposit which I paid today. The house is 3 bedroom and completely redone. It has no yard but a large patio and community pool/tennis/clubhouse. It has lame HOA fee, unfortunately.

    It's 3 bedroom and completely redone inside. It's the cheapest of any of the houses we bid on and it's actually a house we bid on 2 bids ago. It came on the market again for some unknown reason. It's very popular with people looking at it. It's not really pretty on the outside but it's an ok starter home for house newbs.

    They want a $3,000 lease break fee (IRVINE APARTMENT FUCKERS) that we're hoping to avoid by getting a new person to rent it.

    It's kinda strange that when we come back we'll have to immediately pack up and move.

    We'll see how it goes. I don't have a lot of confidence that I can keep up with the initial costs.

    11/20 - Our 7th bid wasn't accepted. I think something is wrong. There are houses going for cheaper than we're offering that are as good or better than what we're bidding on.

    Also Fannie, Freddie Suspend Foreclosures Through Jan. 9 (Update2)

    10/23 - Well I found a house that's really close to work. I bid on it. That's my 6th bid now. It's way cheaper than the previous ones.

    9/19 -

  • California home sales surge as prices plummet

    9/9 - Right now I just want to wait and save up more money. I didn't have enough to start off anyway, I just had a little over the down payment.

    9/4 - We decided yesterday to not buy the house. I did pay for the inspection but oh well. The payments were going to be like $4,000 a month. I don't see why they can't tell me that beforehand...It doesn't matter really. Even if we got a cheaper payment, HotLikeMe isn't ready to give up all the party/fun to work.

    9/1 - So we discover today that buried in the offer on an addendum was an acceptance of our 5k in closing costs. So they actually did accept our original offer. So now we're going to go forward with it and do an inspection.

    8/30 - Update: decided not to buy it because of closing costs.

    So I get over to sign the papers on the house when I'm surprised with that the bank won't pay closing costs. So I'm looking at something like 10k extra to even get in the place. You'd never catch up from that. The only way to raise that money is to gut my 401k or get a loan from my 401k. So that means more money per month on a 2nd loan and if I'm ever fired (which you never know with me) I have 90 days to pay it back. So someone gives me a line of "well if you lose your job you got bigger problems like how to pay your rent." I think you'd be looking at something like 30k to even get in a house. Then you'd be so strapped you'd never make it because you need that initial money to get the house going etc. So I'm thinking don't do it. The house is perfect and a deal though but hey we all want Lamborghini. Doesn't mean we can afford them.

    8/29 - Our Bid was Accepted - Just got an update that the people buying house #4 fell through because of repair costs. So we will have an inspector come in next week see just what those repair costs are. They accepted our offer and we'll see. I don't have $$ to do massive repairs at this point. I barely have enough to get into it. If the repairs are too bad, I'll have to quit out too.

    The area is nice. I guess the school area isn't that great but you can petition to move.

    I think even if things got bad, the house will still sell for 20-40k more than what I paid (if I pay).

    It has an above ground spa, hope it works.

    8/24 - Bid #5 -Looked at a house 3 doors down from our dream home. This one has a pool and jacuzzi. The place was so crowded with buyers that in 20 mins there was 9 sets of families trying to see the place. There were about 25 business cards in 3 days. That's how huge the demand is here. Every house goes in 3 days. The biggest shit house that requires like 100k+ in work still sold too. Anyway on the above house, I'd love to have a jacuzzi and we love pools but I'm not a huge fan of maintaining one. They said $65 a month for a pool guy. Also the pool might still need repairs. I have no faith we'll ever win any of these houses anymore. We bid like 30k over.

    8/23 - Checked out a house yesterday. It had a few probs, it had no bath tubs. The backyard was all cement and a pool but after talking to the pool guy, the pool had probs. It was nice and clear and after 1 week it was green swamp water. It's leaking or something. I said forget it.

    We looked at another house about 3 houses down from bid #3. We even saw the jerks out there on their lawn. We thought they might be freaked that we're stalking them since we bid twice. Why won't they sell us their house. TT.

    8/20 - Just heard we failed on Bid #4. I liked that house too. I'm so sad/depressed about it. I just want to give up and so does HotLikeMe. Maybe a better house will come along but it sucks that you want these houses and even have the money (just not cash) but you can't buy them. You get attached to ones after making offers only to never hear back or to lose. Bank Foreclosures suck because the Banks are such assholes about getting back to you.

    We're going to try one last ditch bid on our dream home, Bid #3 (3 bedroom, awesome backyard/kitchen). It says backup offers accepted and maybe they won't be able to sell to their friend after all.

    I think we will go renting month to month which costs an extra $200 a month penalty and look for about 3 months then quit. I'm ditching cable too. That's almost $275 over 3 months.

    8/18 -

  • Research firm says Southern California home prices fall 31 percent in July, while sales climb

    Bid #4 (2 Story with Spa)

    4 Bedroom with Spa. Two Story. Bank Forclosure. Waiting on response.

    Bid #3 (Awesome Kitchen/Roman Garden Home)

    Awesome backyard and kitchen. As talked about previously we made a bid and the sellers rejected and claimed to sell to a friend. But then they put the house back on the market with a better picture and description. But then it changed to Back Up Offers Accepted. Then it changed to Contingent. We think that means they're selling the house to a friend but only if the friend first sells their house. We're calling for details. What nonsense. We want to buy now. I wish they would just not be assholes and say we don't want to sell our hose. We said we'll still buy and their agent is supposed to let us know if they want to sell.

    8/16 - So the house we really liked and bid on but they rejected, and they claimed they are selling it to a friend. Well it's back on the market again today. Fuckers man. They claim "sellers are motivated" which is a lie.

    Also our 2nd bid, train track house was lowered 20k but they never responded to our offer that was way above that. Idiots.

    8/15 - You read all this crap about the housing market but here is how it is in REAL LIFE. All of the houses are being bought unless they totally suck. They are being bought 2-3 days if they are good. But the houses are down in price 100-200k. For example, the house I'm bidding on is down 200k+.

    Bid #4

    Found ANOTHER 4 bedroom that we're going to try to make an offer on. This time it's crappier inside but 4 bedrooms and more space and a spa. We'll see.

    Turns out that house was owned by a Mexican guy who got deported and the bank took it over. The wife of the guy then tried to rent it out to keep up until the bank took it over. It needs new carpet and appliances.

    8/14 - Update2: The sellers have another offer (NOT OURS) going through with full price (no $ for closing cost). Ours included 12k closing cost. They told us to be patient and see what happens with that offer. We think that if they don't accept/decline our offer within 72 hours, that's just it. Basically they're just dicking us around so I'm just going to forget all about it. We don't even know if they really want to sell at all to begin with. It would be cool if they would just say NO so we aren't hanging on and getting our hopes up.

    This is our 3rd failed offer on 3 different houses so we're tried of losing and our lease is up so we're just going to re-sign our lease. If we have to break the lease (which will suck at $3,000+ penalty) we will just do it :( or we may just go month to month rent.

    Original Update - Doesn't look good for our offer. Yesterday their agent wouldn't get back to us. Our agent called the seller and they wouldn't discuss it or give any impression on their answer and just said talk to their agent (aka Talk to my Lawyer). We get the impression the guy wants to sell and is cool but the wife is a bitch. If this doesn't work out both of us are going to be very sad because it's our dream house. We'll probably quit looking for a while. So far in the last week 5 houses have had their prices increase by 50k. :( :( :(

    8/13 - Well no news on our offer. That gets us scared. If they aren't interested we would like to at least hear so. We're still hoping. If they reject it, we'll probably just save up.

    8/12 - Heard some news today that they might be making a counter offer. Better than a rejection. We're so excited about the house. I hope we can get it AND pay for it. haha.

    Might find out today if they take our offer on the house.

  • Banks' Subprime Losses Top $500 Billion on Writedowns (Update1)
  • Fed holds first auction for 84-day loans
  • One Third of New Owners Owe More Than House Is Worth

    Everything here is selling out in 1-2 days unless it's a Short Sale. We went to some house that went up on Friday or Saturday that was a bank forclosure and it was sold on Monday. It needed a ton of work too and there were a lot of problems with it. Two houses even jacked up the prices 50k. So whatever housing problems people are talking about don't seem to apply here in OC. The houses have dropped 100-200k BUT they're being bought by someone. We speculated it's foreigners using oil money! :)

  • Mortgages get more expensive - again

    8/11 - Part 2 - Trying to make an offer on another house today. It is one we've wanted for a while. We'll see if they take it. Today I ate lunch for $1.51!

    8/11 - Turns out that $3,900 a month guy might be full of shit. Wellsfargo offered only $3,500 a month. Which still seems like insane BUT I'm essentially paying $3,000 a month already because of the money I'd get back on taxes for owning a house. Also HotLikeMe is going to kick in on rent. So the lesson is, shop around for a LENDER because they will lie about interest rates, payments, and closing costs.

    HotLikeMe's sister went to a lender. He said $6,000 closing costs and a rate. They happened to check someone else and it was only $2,500 closing costs. They told the first GUY they didn't want to take his loan and when the papers got submitted to escrow, the first guy sent his papers in anyway with only $1,500. He was lying and was doing something to get the loan. THEN after they went with the more honest girl for $2,500, she still sold the loan to Citibank to make $$. Also the Real Estate agent is getting $ for referring you to the shady lender.

    8/9 - Well looked at a 500k house but the payment would be $3,900. That's the jumbo rate too. In January, they increase the jumbo rate but it's only a savings of about $150/month. No way.

  • Time to lock in your mortgage rate
  • Irvine called 4th best place to live in U.S.
  • Irvine home sales down 39% in June; median price down 15.4%

    8/7 - Made an offer on an Irvine House. The last offer we made we were filling out the offer when it was noticed as sold. I really wanted that last one. It needs work on the landscape but inside just needs some carpet and paint as far as I can see. We weren't totally hyped about it but it does have a perfect Irvine location. It's the perfect Fisher Price My First House™. We low-balled on the offer so I'm expecting it to fail. It was bank forclosure. We noticed there's a lot of foreclosures around the same area.

    The houses around are down 100-200k in price since a few years ago. They're all selling out in a few days to a week. People are buying up like mad. Every house I look at has tons of people looking at them. The one best house we found didn't sell because it had HORRIBLE pictures of it on the web despite it being super awesome. We missed that one but I think the winner offered way above what I could ever pay.

    After this house offer fails (unless something crazy happens), we'll either keep looking or wait on the apartment lease being up and save some more downpayment. As long as you have 3% it doesn't matter if you have more unless you have 20% of the downpayment. Also if you can get to January, they raise the Jumbo loan number higher than $417k. Nearly every house in OC is over 417k so that number is bs to begin with.

    But if I don't buy this year, I lose a huge chunk of taxes, like I do every year. It's only several hundred dollars more to buy a house and I plan on cutting costs by doing less and maybe ditching cable/gamefly for $120 a month. We'll also get $100 back by getting rid of our storage unit.

    I wish I could make some decent $ on advertising. I can't seem to clear more than $75 or so a month. I was going to get lots from Google Adsense until they banned me.


  • Looking at a house today. The only prob is it's near some train tracks. I wonder how bad that would be.

    8/5

    Back to looking at houses again. We keep finding ones we want but then they get instantly sold. I was trying to buy before my lease is up. The leasing place keeps calling to lock us into an 8 or 12 month lease.

    I got approved again for up to 500k house.

  • America's Most Overpriced ZIP Codes
  • California hints at bottom to housing slump

    Update 3 : Looks like I don't qualify for the $7,500 tax break cuz I make too much money :( The Salary sounds great but when rent is $2,000 a month and taxes are like 28% it disappears pretty quickly. California Gas is also some of the most expensive in the country. Last check was $4.60/gal.

    "First Time Homebuyer Tax Credit Provision of the Housing and Economic Recovery Act of 2008"

    Update 2 : WoW, like 20 mins later, the 2nd house we wanted sold too at full price. :( The problem now is my lease is up and the fuckers at Irivine Company raised the lease break fees to $3300 from like $2300 because they don't want people buying houses.

    Update 1 : Haha now we're back to looking again. After running the numbers for everything, it would only be like $300 more for a house vs. renting + the $7,500 government payback for first time buyers.

  • Bush signs housing bill in private - F-er.

    We're going to wait to buy for now. I can sign a 6 month or 1 year lease.


    Link - If you don't hate Bush by now, you should after this. F-ing with the market. The people losing their homes because they got bad loans should be. They should go back to renting while the people who deserve houses but don't have them yet should be able to move in.

    Already in California, people are buying up these forclosed/bank homes like crazy. We went house shopping today and at some bank owned ghetto home they had a ton of people there. That crap will sell.

    HotLikeMe is concerned that we need to buy now or we're f-ed.

    Update 9:49 p.m.
    We tried to make an offer on a house we liked yesterday that was available yesterday and today the sale is pending already. We lost it. Nuts man. People are buying up every home instantly. HotLikeMe has been daily watching all the homes on the sites.

    Update 12:53 p.m.
    We looked at a 500k house and that's the one we would want but can't afford at all. The payment would be $3500 a month with $30k down. I don't even have 30k. I'd be lucky to scrounge up 10k. I'm looking at a loan with 3% down. HotLikeMe already owns a house and knows all this crap. I know nothing about this stuff at all despite my mom being a Real Estate agent for 10 years in the area.

    We're looking at some 400-475k houses. We found a house we really want. It needs some fixing up. We may make an offer on it. If that doesn't work out, we may wait. Every place we check out has like at least 1-5 people already there checking at the same time. Seems like people are buying up like MAD around here. We also saw another attached 3 bedroom Irvine place we liked. Only problem is it has no yard except a concret yard and it's right next to the freeway so you can hear lots of freeway noise when you're outside. Otherwise it's pretty cool. It's banked owned and the previous owners kicked out a bunch of the wall cuz they were mad they were being booted or something.

    I really could go either way, buy or not buy. I just don't want to get trapped in some huge payment that I can't keep up with. I got pre-approved for up to 500k. My buddy who just bought a house says being pre-approved is easy. Random info: my 401k lost $11k last year! like $8k the year before that. I think I'm looking at like $1,000 increase in rent per month. Personally I don't think the tax savings will make up for that. I think I'll have to cut off about everything I do. I also don't see how I'd have enough $ for repairs/upgrades.

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    bschultz
    Special Forces

    July 28th, 2008 @ 1:11AM

    Registered:
    2003-03-26
    Location:
    Bend, OR
    Posts: 385
    shes mostly right. You have about a year window. Things can still get worse, a lot of people are holding out on walking away from their homes in hopes of the government on bailing them out.

    Its easy to say they are idiots and that they should have known, but its the american dream to own a home. Im not talking about the spot home investors here, I mean the people that bought the houses to live in.
    hardcore puppy
    Peon

    July 28th, 2008 @ 2:06AM

    Registered:
    2003-11-02
    Location:
    Irvine, CA
    Posts: 140
    I dont blame the people for the situation they are in. Lets say someone was in your position right now.. All their debts are taken care of. As in: college loans, car payments, no credit card debt, etc etc. Now, lets say they are starting to look at houses and they hear from EVERYONE that houses are a great investment.. it`ll always get more expensive, and its something you want, something you`ll need sooner or later, and renting is like throwing away money. Heck, I even heard this stuff from my High School economics teacher.

    Now, they just bought a house and everything seems fine as the only debt they owe right now is their home. All fine and dandy right? Well all of a sudden, the price of their home drops dramatically , recession is back, gas prices are skyrocketing causing transportation to be more costly as well as food. And on top of that, the reason why you started looking for a bigger place is because you have a kid on the way. Not to mention some of the people could have been laid-off..

    How is this the home-buyer`s fault? I dont get it..
    SaFFiRe
    Peon

    July 28th, 2008 @ 5:03AM

    Registered:
    2003-10-08
    Location:
    CA
    Posts: 16
    I agree with you Nebu. It is their fault! The reason why is simple. They didn`t get a fixed home loan and now their monthly mortgage bill is a lot higher than they can afford. I have no sympathy for people who don`t do their research on these things. It`s their fault, not the government, not the economy and certainly not gas prices/food costs.

    Get a good home loan and you`ll be fine...I`m holding out until I move to another city. My company may want me in D.C.
    Colombo
    Peon

    July 28th, 2008 @ 5:29AM

    Registered:
    2003-03-26
    Location:
    China
    Posts: 448
    hardcore puppy - the situation you describe is not as it exists currently. The current housing crisis resulted from lenders providing loans to buyers who had poor credit ratings (i.e. a bad record of payment or incomes too low to justify significant loans) irresponsibly, while the buyers borrowed and spent beyond a level that was realistically responsible. Sure, some people may have gotten swindled and are burning for it now, but I say let `em burn. In the game of life we`re always happy when we get a great deal and always pissed when we get screwed - that doesn`t mean you make your neighbor pay for it. If there`s going to be a bailout (of individual buyers, not bankers) I say the ones who fucked up can pay for it.

    The government should provide some guidance and basic, unmarketable services (infrastructure, certain types of education, etc) - it shouldn`t bail you out because you made a stupid bet listening to every idiot pundit on TV.
    aFrayedKnot
    Peon

    July 28th, 2008 @ 6:52AM

    Registered:
    2003-03-26
    Location:
    WI
    Posts: 162
    what about lenders? Phil Gramm of the McCain camp has deregulated the industry so much. F`ing republicans are never for the little guy.
    Constrictor
    Grunt

    July 28th, 2008 @ 6:58AM

    Registered:
    2003-06-08
    Location:
    Bridgewater, NJ
    Posts: 116
    @ hardcore puppy

    From what I know, these people got adjustable rate mortgates at 'too good to be true' rates. They knew or should have known that they were getting too much house for too little money and it couldn't last.

    Many people feel they are entitled to a certain lifestyle (fueled by TV and other mass media). The consume now and worry about it later mentality should not be rewarded.
    Crazieman
    Special Forces

    July 28th, 2008 @ 7:40AM

    Registered:
    2003-03-25
    Location:
    Wichita, Kansas, USA
    Posts: 466
    They're idiots who took an ARM at the lowest rates in history. It could go nowhere else but up.

    There were also idiots who lied about how much they made to mortgage companies. The rest were people trying to flip houses and got caught.

    No sympathy. You bought something you couldn't pay for. Suffer the consequences. Whats up with this screwed up no-fault society?
    BlueFalcon
    Word To Your Mom

    July 28th, 2008 @ 7:58AM

    Registered:
    2003-04-27
    Location:
    Filth-a-delphia
    Posts: 1029
    I love how this article is dubbed a "Housing Rescue Bill". You could change the title of the article to "Taxpayer Ripoff Bill Awaits President Bush's Signature" and it would be more accurate. Personally, I'm outraged that as a non-homeowner, my tax dollars are going to bailout people who made bad decisions (or even calculated fraud). People have a way out of bad loans, it's called foreclosure. That's a market-driven mechanism to overcome issues like owing more on a house than it is worth. The government interfering and propping up home prices by bailing out homeowners and lenders alike is just hurting people like you and I. It's interesting that while on the one hand you castigate Bush for opposing this bill, and on the other hand you feel pressured to buy now. This bill is working against you and your desire to get into the home ownership game. The bailout adds a considerable degree of uncertainty to the market. In earlier housing comments, I stated that the market would probably bottom out in Q1 or Q2 of 2010. Now, there is the threat that things may bottom out prematurely if this bill works. Your boy Ron Paul is none too pleased with all this. Nowhere in the Constitution does it say anything about the government bankrolling people to pursue, "Life, Liberty, and a series of irresponsible, bad decisions made in an attempt to secure happiness through over-consumption." They must have added that when we weren't looking.

    If I were you, I'd still wait. If you have a realtor, I'm sure this person is whispering in your ear that the time to buy is NOW. It probably isn't, but it certainly benefits the realtor if you buy now and I'm sure you feel the pressure to expand your square footage. Real estate is a sales job, so they see the hungry look in your eyes and tell you what you need to hear to keep feeding that hunger. Prices are either going to continue to fall and hit a bottom, or they will begin to rebound. On a graph, that looks like the letter U (though not nearly so steep). You can pull the trigger too early and get in while prices are falling, thus ending up on the left hand side of the U. The alternative is to see that a recovery is for real, and buy on the right hand side of the U. It's doubtful you'll hit the very bottom, but given the choice you probably want to get in on the recovery side of things.

    The only way I think it makes sense to get in now is if you can get a house for what you currently pay in rent, or slightly more (up to 25% more, since that's about what you'll get back in taxes due to mortgage interest deduction). Even if values continue to fall, at least it's not really costing you anything in monthly expenses.

    Just don't panic and buy too soon. There is still a very healthy pipeline of potential foreclosures leading into Q1 of 2010. Is the worst part of the decline behind us? Yes, but that doesn't mean the decline is over. Also, the recovery will not be a bounce, but probably a several year period of sideways movement in prices. It's not like people will suddenly have any credit leverage to run prices back up again. They have nowhere to get that leverage. The stock market has declined, housing has been a disaster, and incomes are threatened by increased unemployment. On the cost side, commodities like food, gasoline, and imported goods have gone up in price. Aside from the government's $300+ billion spit in the wind, where is all this money coming from that is supposed to cause a big recovery?

    http://bubblemeter.blogspot.com/ (good compendium of housing related blogs, many of which deal specifically with CA or SoCal).

    http://www.socalbubble.com/ (Look at that foreclosure chart. Does that look like a recovery?)

    EDIT--I'm disappointed in earlier commenters who are so quick to excuse the bad decisions made by individual homeowners. Were there some people who went into the housing market and were unequipped to make a proper decision? Sure. The vast majority, however, should have known better. They got caught up in the housing mania, and thought they could have it all (the SUV, the big flat screen TV, the vacations, and some $400k P.O.S. condo in an over-heated housing market). If these folks get foreclosed, it's not like they are going to be homeless. They will just have to go back to renting until they can find something that is affordable to them. Yeah, that's right, they'll have to make lifestyle choices appropriate to their income level. It's shocking medicine, I know, but folks have been doing it since the dawn of time. Americans are no different.

    EDITED: 2008-07-28 08:43:10
    forest_queen
    Dame

    July 28th, 2008 @ 8:53AM

    Registered:
    2003-03-26
    Location:
    WA
    Posts: 1150
    I agree with bluefalcon.

    It's too bad you actually want to buy in CA when there are so many other beautiful areas to live for much much less. I wouldn't even consider buying in CA, not with the inflated housing market and house prices dropping continually. And I'd especially be leary after this news of Bush signing the bill to waste our tax money.
    AfterBurn
    Grunt

    July 28th, 2008 @ 10:24AM

    Registered:
    2003-03-25
    Location:
    Phoenix, AZ
    Posts: 363
    Your girl might be jumping the gun a bit saying that you have to buy NOW. I saw a few other people saying you have about a year window or such... also not the worst advice ever. Truth is, nobody knows how long the current turmoil will last. We may still be heading for a recession which would see another big cut in home values, especially in our states. At the end of the day, so long as you are paying attention, and you are, you wont miss your chance to buy at the right time. It will take a few quarters to the markets to rebound once they stop tanking and that is when you want to make your move.

    As for the current situation... it will get worse. There is more bad news coming for sure - major banks are preparing for more massive write downs as people keep defaulting. I know a woman here in AZ that stopped paying her mortgage months ago and had planned to walk away from her home in August. BAD people like her are not yet accounted for and they are all over the place.

    Just keep an eye on things and you will know when it is right to buy. While right now is much better than a couple years ago, chances are it gets even better as our markets correct themselves. That said, with banks failing and GDP likely to dip the next couple quarters, my money is on playing the waiting game and picking something up once the dust settles.
    killer6600
    Peon

    July 28th, 2008 @ 10:27AM

    Registered:
    2007-06-16
    Location:
    canada
    Posts: 553
    you`re all wrong, this bill needs to be passed, war on terror here people, first thing said after 9/11, go shop, keep buying things. well thats what happened, and these banks were doing their patriotic duty to help the war effort, and the people were doing their best to kill osama, by buying bigger and better houses.

    every acre owned by an american is 1 less acre on the planet for him to hide.

    this bill is just body armor for the american shopping soldier.


    netsavior
    Grunt

    July 28th, 2008 @ 10:39AM

    Registered:
    2003-08-13
    Location:
    Thousand Oaks, CA
    Posts: 271
    The following are dumbass moves that have cause major economic woes
    1) Buying houses thinking the value will go up
    2) Buying houses hoping the value will not go down
    3) Treating your house like a credit card
    4) Treating your house like a savings account
    5) Treating your house like a retirement account

    The truth is, unless you are a well-researched investor, with money to burn/money to lose or are wealthy enough to have a house as a "luxury" item the ONLY REASON to buy a house is because you are 99.9% positive you want to live there for 10+ years, and that you will never want to move, and you are willing to take the risks associated... Especially in Southern California.

    Common traps people fall for:
    Tax Write off - ZOMG you get to skip taxes on the money you set on fire each month! Awesome, it will be like you get to keep 20 cents out of every dollar you give away to a bank! At least it isn't going to the government!

    Building Equity - For the first 5+ years you are putting only pennies on the dollar into equity, and one market bump can erase all that "savings" in a weekend.

    I live in Thousand Oaks CA... if I were to buy the house I am currently renting, my monthly payment (not including repairs) would go up by about $1700 per month. Lets say 200 of that was going in to equity... what if instead of spending that 1700/month on "owning" a house I put HALF that much into a dirty mattress (not gaining interest)
    at the end of 5 years you would have 13,000 in equity assuming a stagnent market, with no garuntee, you could possibly have a lot more, or a lot less... if you take the monthly payment difference, invest only in insured investment products... say at 4% you would have $111,008 in 5 years.

    So short term, 5 years I could have either $111,008, or possibly from -100,000 in equity to +200,000 in equity... it seems like a simple gamble to me, especially since I am living in the exact same home either way. Take it out to 10 years and the savings account is more like $250k

    The reason it works, is because for the person with the 400k cash to plop down on a home can earn a nice return, say $2000/month rent on that investment (6% annual return) plus he gets REAL tax benefits, like depreciation write-off... not just a write off of the money he wasted on interest.

    Not all markets are like southern california, but for most people, who don't have a giant wad of cash, it is actually way cheaper to rent... for me it is cheaper to rent, unless I plan on owning my home for 29 years... and I have never done anything for 29 years in a row.
    Slev
    Grunt

    July 28th, 2008 @ 12:00PM

    Registered:
    2003-03-26
    Location:
    Seattle
    Posts: 433
    don't worry, we got the money. only $490 billion deficit next year :)
    Nebuchadnezzar
    Admin

    July 28th, 2008 @ 12:26PM

    Registered:
    2003-03-20
    Location:
    Irvine, CA
    Posts: 2884
    From what I know, these people got adjustable rate mortgates at 'too good to be true' rates. They knew or should have known that they were getting too much house for too little money and it couldn't last.

    Many people feel they are entitled to a certain lifestyle (fueled by TV and other mass media). The consume now and worry about it later mentality should not be rewarded.


    I agree.

    We looked at a 500k house and that's the one we would want but can't afford at all. The payment would be $3500 a month with $30k down. I don't even have 30k.

    We're looking at some 400-475k houses. We found a house we really want. It needs some fixing up. We may make an offer on it. If that doesn't work out, we may wait. We also saw another attached 3 bedroom Irvine place we liked. Only problem is it has no yard except a concret yard and it's right next to the freeway so you can hear lots of freeway noise when you're outside. Otherwise it's pretty cool. It's banked owned and the previous owners kicked out a bunch of the wall cuz they were mad they were being booted or something.

    I really could go either way, buy or not buy. I just don't want to get trapped in some huge payment that I can't keep up with. I got pre-approved for up to 500k. My buddy who just bought a house says being pre-approved is easy. Random info: my 401k lost $11k last year! like $8k the year before that. I think I'm looking at like $1,000 increase in rent per month. Personally I don't think the tax savings will make up for that. I think I'll have to cut off about everything I do. I also don't see how I'd have enough $ for repairs/upgrades.

    EDITED: 2008-07-28 12:34:55
    Darren
    Red State Cowboy

    July 28th, 2008 @ 12:27PM

    Registered:
    2004-08-30
    Location:
    Dallas, TX
    Posts: 1022
    As a professional in this business with 10 years in it, I would tell you to hold off. The market is in a state of decline and honestly we have not seen the end of this mess. Homeowners are responsible for what was said previously - good ol' American greed, obtaining historically low ARMs, and not doing their research.

    People used to save for their down payments, bought within their means, and obtained responsible loans.

    The kind of crap I've seen over the past 8 years makes me wonder why people think they deserved homes and why banks were willing to lend money to deadbeats. Oh wait, the banks made big money on these deadbeats. So it's both of their problems, not the taxpayer. Bush would be more of a dolt than I already think he is if he bailed these people out.

    Hang on there Nebu, wait for the market to turn around a little better and save for your down payment. No reason to lose more money yet.
    RowdyRoddyPiper
    Nut Job

    July 28th, 2008 @ 12:47PM

    Registered:
    2003-06-20
    Location:
    Nashville TN
    Posts: 1018
    if you can seriously do it i recommend finding you a nice comfy house on a bit of land, learn gardening and plan to be self sufficient. all the top economists say in less than 3 years we are going into a hardcore depression. you do NOT want to be smack dab in the middle of all these people when the depression hits. it will be house to house looting and/or fires. this suv driving dumb yuppy public will go insane once they lose everything. think LA riots times a million. the govt is only propping up the economy as best they can by tossing more dollars out there, buying out banks to keep the wool over everyones eys so it doesnt get all shoved on their golden boys obama and hillary. only after they are in, a new war will start and the economy will be fully let go to go into ruin and they can blame that new war...most likely pakistan and iran (this came out at bilderberg 2008) they have to kill this country to kill the dollar so the euro becomes the one worl currency. thats official imf world bank documents leaked from joseph stiglitz who quit the imf once he found out what they planned. heres part 1 of 4 of an interview with him. watch it! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xgP92D_jusk
    Slev
    Grunt

    July 28th, 2008 @ 12:51PM

    Registered:
    2003-03-26
    Location:
    Seattle
    Posts: 433
    Gotta agree with Darren... my wife and I are pretty much doing exactly what he said: waiting a little while longer and continuing to save. We own a townhouse we bought 3 years ago and are ready to move on to a real house (no shared walls), but decided we'd be better off waiting a little while and saving up more, even though we could afford it now. No reason to be rushed right now while prices are still dropping.
    Nalcolm
    Thinker

    July 28th, 2008 @ 1:33PM

    Registered:
    2005-04-16
    Location:
    Posts: 561
    If you're serious about buying, then for three months put aside as much money as you would be making for a mortgage payment.

    At the end of three months, you'll know if you could stand living like that, because you will have been. You'll also have some money put aside for a downpayment.

    It's good advice for buying a car, too.
    Miamihrrcne
    Peon

    July 28th, 2008 @ 1:43PM

    Registered:
    2004-03-12
    Location:
    Miami
    Posts: 669
    so let me get this straight. the budget deficit is a new record at nearly half a trillion dollars. the US is already something like 11 trillion in debt (to businesses and foreign investors). and now they want to bail people out by assuming the debt on these bad loans. seems like a losing equation to me.

    where will they get the money to bail out lenders and home owners? from other countries? are they going to print the money? it spells disaster. it isn`t going to happen now (though it sure seems like they are doing everything they can to cause an absolute economic catastrophe at this point), but even if it happens to our kids it isn`t acceptable.

    maybe it is time to hit the reset button. obviously the way our economy and culture are calibrated right now isn`t the right way. didn`t einstein say that the definition of insanity is doing something the same way over and over again and expecting different results. none of what anyone with any power are saying right now will fix any of this, and it is a snowball heading down a hill getting bigger and bigger and most people are just fine with what steps are being done.
    nate_orenstam
    Special Forces

    July 28th, 2008 @ 3:02PM

    Registered:
    2003-04-05
    Location:
    Posts: 1166
    do a good job of figuring out how much you save on taxes with your mortgage before you jump to any conclusions on what you can afford. you might be surprised at what a great tax shelter a house payment can be, especially up-front when almost none of your payment goes to principal.

    hardcore puppy, you're ridiculous. if someone overextends themselves financially, why shouldn't they get themselves out of the situation without public assistance? home ownership isn't a damned birthright. if you lose your house because your mouth wrote checks your body couldn't cash, rent a room somewhere, sell most of your crap, and start the hell over without making uncle scam foot your bill.
    Desler
    Peon

    July 28th, 2008 @ 3:19PM

    Registered:
    2006-10-10
    Location:
    Posts: 93
    Gotta agree with Piper. Instead of a house, buy some land and bury some can goods and bottled water underneath it.
    ROBOKATZ
    Peon

    July 28th, 2008 @ 4:12PM

    Registered:
    2003-03-25
    Location:
    Gainesville, FL
    Posts: 389
    Get out of California.
    Wootah
    non-leet

    July 28th, 2008 @ 4:26PM

    Registered:
    2003-05-16
    Location:
    Utah
    Posts: 1108
    Ramen and Shells ladies and gentlemen, ramen and shells. Gotta invest in them now before your paper money is worthless and the world is chaos. Then you can hole up in your mountain compound in Wyoming and shoot anybody who tries to steal your ramen!
    Ykant
    Peon

    July 28th, 2008 @ 4:31PM

    Registered:
    2004-09-14
    Location:
    Chicago, USA
    Posts: 110
    I know the realtors are telling you to buy now. They have mortgages, too. Have you ever known a realtor to tell someone NOT to buy? That`s their deal - their percentage comes right off the top they could give a crap if you can afford it.

    Wait it out a little longer. There`s more people trying to bail out right around the corner. Look for foreclosure homes. There`s going to be no shortage for a little while yet.

    A friend of mine just picked up a place in a decent part of town for 20% of last year`s asking price, just because the owner wanted out and his bank was okay with it.
    Nebuchadnezzar
    Admin

    July 28th, 2008 @ 5:09PM

    Registered:
    2003-03-20
    Location:
    Irvine, CA
    Posts: 2884
    Well we are using a broker that is a friend. We knew her long before she became one. She sold 3 other company coworkers houses already.

    EDITED: 2008-07-28 21:48:50
    Apricoth
    Kali Compton Girl

    July 28th, 2008 @ 5:12PM

    Registered:
    2003-06-14
    Location:
    MN
    Posts: 1739
    Nebu - you and your family need to wait. Do not get suckered into buying a home now. Don't... Do.. It.. You are contending with bottom feeders now - just wait.
    Jeff
    Diablo Fan

    July 28th, 2008 @ 6:03PM

    Registered:
    2003-06-03
    Location:
    IL
    Posts: 359
    Yeah, I don't see what the rush is. Every article I read says this is going to last for a while. Meanwhile you should be saving up for a larger down payment. Also, here are some calculators which might help:
    How much house can you afford?
    What will your mortgage payment be?
    BlueFalcon
    Word To Your Mom

    July 28th, 2008 @ 7:21PM

    Registered:
    2003-04-27
    Location:
    Filth-a-delphia
    Posts: 1029
    Update 6:00 p.m. We tried to make an offer on a house we like yesterday that was available yesterday and today the sale is pending. Nuts man. People are buying up every home instant. HotLikeMe has been daily watching all the homes on the sites

    Ugh, don't do it man. I really think we're going to see a classic "double dip" in prices. Things have leveled off briefly, and people are in a lather to snap up what they perceive as good values. That's especially true in SoCal where you have seen more than a decade of outsized price growth. People are so conditioned to spot a deal, that they think there are all sorts of good deals in the market right now. It's an illusion. There are still plenty of foreclosures to come. In fact, the front page of that socal housing bubble site I linked updated. The author explicitly mentions the possibility of a double dip (he calls it a dead cat bounce), for reasons of credit/liquidity tightening up. Whatever price stability you think you see in SoCal is being driven by people who have been locked out of the housing market for a decade or more. They see 2004-2005 prices (or better in some cases) and think they are getting a steal. I go back to my statement from a few weeks back that you need to be thinking of 2002-2003 prices for that market. When those prices come around, you can feel confident that the worst is over.

    If you feel comfortable losing 20-25 percent of your purchase price in the next 18 months (and then waiting 3-5 years for it to recover), then go ahead and jump in the water. Based on the houses you've been talking about, that puts you about $100k upside down (about -$5500/mo for 18 months). As a few others have mentioned, if you plan to be there for 7+ years it may not be the worst thing in the world. You can spread your wings a bit, which is something you haven't been able to do your entire adult life. I don't envy your position. On the one hand, you have a new family living in a 2-bedroom apt, and pressure to expand. On the other hand, you are in this super expensive market and have a bunch of 1s and 0s on this website telling you to bide your time. If we're wrong, oh, well we don't live with the consequences. But you do. That being said though, if you can wait 12-18 months, do it. I mean, what's the worst that can happen (from your perspective)? The housing market catches fire and goes up 5-10% in the next year. Do you really see that happening? Really?!?

    EDIT--I was re-reading the comments, and I think Nalcolm's suggestion is brilliant, and is worth repeating. Figure out your PITI on a $450-500K house. Put the difference between that number and your current rent into savings each month. Also, add an extra $200/month for maintenance/landscaping expenses and figure your electric/gas bill will be 50-75% higher than is the case in your apartment (depending on the increase in sq. footage, age of the home, efficiency of the HVAC, etc). I'm guessing your all-in number is somewhere north of $3600/mo on a $450k loan (30 yr, 6.5%, 2500 taxes, 1000 insurance, and the other expenses I mentioned). If you can roll with that, more power to you.

    EDITED: 2008-07-28 19:36:08
    Nebuchadnezzar
    Admin

    July 28th, 2008 @ 8:40PM

    Registered:
    2003-03-20
    Location:
    Irvine, CA
    Posts: 2884
    I'm looking for payments under $3,000.

    And if you buy before July 2009 or so you get $7,500 from the government.
    AfterBurn
    Grunt

    July 28th, 2008 @ 11:55PM

    Registered:
    2003-03-25
    Location:
    Phoenix, AZ
    Posts: 363
    The market will keep sinking... You are talking about $3000 payments, then you can be saving $60,000 or more if the housing market dips another 20% which looks likely. Even if it does not reach that level, it will approach it almost certainly, and that equates to $30,000 at a modest %10 decline.
    Nebuchadnezzar
    Admin

    July 29th, 2008 @ 1:34AM

    Registered:
    2003-03-20
    Location:
    Irvine, CA
    Posts: 2884
    HotLikeMe read through all your comments (took like 45 mins). We're going to renew our lease for either 6 months or 1 year. But they're charging us $2,000 a month. :( If you go anywhere else it's $2,300 for 2 bedrooms.
    Signum666
    Grunt

    July 29th, 2008 @ 2:25AM

    Registered:
    2003-10-27
    Location:
    Netherlands
    Posts: 432
    Making a good decision hurts instantly; making a bad one will hurt you more on the longer term.

    Me and my girlfriend are bying a house in Januari. Total costs: $236.085,-. And this is a 5 room appartment with a garden. Together we make about a gross $4.721,-. We had to wait about a year before such on offer came.

    Just wait for the good offer to arrive. Don't choose something you aren't 100% certain with. Trust your gut feeling.
    Desler
    Peon

    July 29th, 2008 @ 5:28AM

    Registered:
    2006-10-10
    Location:
    Posts: 93
    I don`t think the 7500$ is enough of an incentive to be rushed into a decision this important. It took me 3 months to buy a house, and my friend took like 5 months to find one for him. We`re both very happy with our purchases, as we got good deals and the houses we wanted.

    Also, in case no one has told you yet, don`t forget about yearly property taxes which are collected by your county. My house has to be payed close to 4000$ yearly and is valued at 155kish, so I don`t want to think what a house that costs 400-500k is going to cost yearly. You can qualify for some exemptions possibly, but they won`t take that huge a chunk out of the payment.
    Miamihrrcne
    Peon

    July 29th, 2008 @ 6:10AM

    Registered:
    2004-03-12
    Location:
    Miami
    Posts: 669
    my wife and i make about 6,000 a month total, and we are nowhere near buying a house yet. of course, we also only pay like 1000 a month on rent and we still have like 9 months left on our lease. maybe this winter we`ll look for a house.
    Tapar
    Posting Ninja

    July 29th, 2008 @ 7:36AM

    Registered:
    2003-03-27
    Location:
    NH
    Posts: 187
    I really agree with netsavior's post. If you do not plan to live their for 10+ years you could be setting yourself up for epic failure.

    I hate getting whacked with repair bills too. I had my water heater die and that was like $900 to replace, and it was only that cheap because my dad knows plumbing and was able to install it for me.

    My furnace died on new years eve during an insane cold spell (NH) and that was like $500 for parts and labor.

    My roof is now 20-25 years old and will probably need work soon. My garage roof has a huge hole in it thanks to some neighborhood kids who jumped my fence and climbed onto the easy access roof and put a foot through by accident. That is going to be insanely expensive to repair.

    The little things get you too, like leaky pipes, garbage disposals, getting a dishwasher fixed, getting your driveway re-sealed, ect.

    I thought I had everything worked out when I bought my house and that I really could afford it. I did not count on a number of unexpected things. My electric bill doubled, in an apartment I don't think I was paying the "delivery fee's" which came to like $80. My heat bill was much higher than expected, and I had never gotten a water bill before.

    Thankfully soon after I got the house I got a 15% raise which let me actually afford the house I had just purchased. Still, it was an eye opening experience.

    12 years later I want to find a new job and find myself stuck looking within driving distance. I miss the freedom of being able to move out of the area. My best friend just moved to New Zealand and I kind of wish I could look for work there too.

    I could sell the house, but I would have to dump a bunch of money into fixing it up to make it show-able. It appraised high enough to be worth selling a year ago, now I would be nervous. The last thing I want is to sell it and still owe money.

    I am not the kind of guy who enjoys yard work or puttering around the house, I think that is why I hate owning a house. The only two things I like about it is that I could install my pool and that I can watch movies with the volume up at midnight and not be disturbing anyone. I think many people, especially with kids, tend to enjoy the house owning experience more.

    Oh yeah! Definitely check on the neighbors before you move in! If you have really annoying neighbors there is nothing you can do about it after the fact. I have read some of your horrible neighbor stories and just imagine how much it would suck if you couldn't just move away!

    I am not really advising don't do it, just make sure it is something you really want.

    Charkoth
    Right Wing Extremist

    July 29th, 2008 @ 8:17AM

    Registered:
    2003-05-08
    Location:
    OHIO
    Posts: 1285
    Nebu take my word for it it isn`t worth it.

    I bought my home for a modest $153,000 4 years ago. I now owe $143,000.00. I pay $7,000.00 a year in interest(I have 4.75% on a 5/1 ARM) and another $2200.00 a year in property taxes which compared to the loan you will get and the property taxes you`ll pay will be NOTHING.

    To date my home has LOST at least $10,000.00 in value despite improvements since I moved in(it was a new construction 4 bedroom, 2 1/2 bathroom 2 car attached garage). There is my same house down the street that a guy has been trying to sell for OVER a year now for $145k that has hardly even had a bite. I have to mow my own grass, perform maintenance on my house, and pay 100% of my utilities + insurance. I`ve calculated around $30,000 lost out of pocket since I bought this place in taxes etc even considering the deductions.

    If you can rent for the same or less than what you can own DO IT. The ONLY way you make out by owning a home is in a appreciating market. The market has a while yet till it bottoms out so waiting another year or two can only help.

    Trust me man, don`t be hasty on this decision, you`ll regret it.
    eliw23
    Grunt

    July 29th, 2008 @ 9:00AM

    Registered:
    2003-03-26
    Location:
    NJ
    Posts: 145
    Glad you and HLM have decided to postpone the house hunting. It definitely is a huge expense. You mentioned not having 30K to put down so you'd have to pay points unless you put 20% down. I like the one person's advice to put away what you'd expect your mortgage payment to be + other added expenses and see if you can all survive on what's left. That savings can then be used for a down payment later on. When my husband and I bought our house, we knew we were okay but then about 8 months down the road, I found out I was getting laid off and that sent off panic buttons. Luckily I found another job but if I didn't, things would be extremely tight. Good luck on your search down the road. Definitely don't settle on just "something" since hopefully this will be your family's house for a long time. Take into consideration the kids, yard, school system, etc. I'm sure eventually the housing market will cool down somewhat.
    Zelph01
    Peon

    July 29th, 2008 @ 9:18AM

    Registered:
    2005-06-20
    Location:
    Posts: 486
    I don`t expect that you will have taken my advice, but I will confidently say it is the best you`ll get: Get married before you enter into a contract that approaches a half-million dollars. Ask your accountant.*Nudge Nudge

    You would be an absolute fool to think that it is financially prudent to sign papers on a house without the legal protections of marriage. You may think you`re in love, indeed you may be. But do you really want to play Russian-roulette over a half-million dollars?

    What happens if she dies, there`s an insurance policy and you`re not married, and you don`t have the benefit of a will? Her parents could legally contest the will and you`d spend more on legal fees than it would be worth. And, you would not be able to meet your house payments.

    Or, what happens if YOU die, and the situation is reversed? Do you really want to leave that kind of mess with your g/f and child(ren)?


    http://ezinearticles.com/?Money-Merging-Before-Marriage&id=214549

    http://family.findlaw.com/marriage/living-together/cohabitation-property-basics.html
    DeuceOfSpades
    Kali Compton

    July 29th, 2008 @ 1:47PM

    Registered:
    2003-04-12
    Location:
    Posts: 2981
    I am not sure that I agree with Zelph01 about getting married because California is an alimony state: if you make more than her, you will be paying her after your divorce (this is an extra payment on top of child support). You should be close to 100% sure that your marriage is going to last for life if you're going to take that plunge.

    Charkoth is right: it isn't as cut and dry as "renters are suckers". Buying a home is only worth it if you plan to live there for a very long time, 10 years at an absolute minimum.
    Desler
    Peon

    July 29th, 2008 @ 4:47PM

    Registered:
    2006-10-10
    Location:
    Posts: 93
    And in the meantime, set the money aside you would potentially be paying in mortgage payments (minus your rent) and set it aside in a savings account. Test yourselves as you are residing in your apartment and see if its difficult to avoid having to use the money. Make it an absolute rule to not touch it unless there is an emergency. At the very least, you will have a nice chunk of savings once you make the decision to either buy or wait.
    DeuceOfSpades
    Kali Compton

    July 31st, 2008 @ 12:16PM

    Registered:
    2003-04-12
    Location:
    Posts: 2981
    The $7500 you would get from the government is a paltry sum compared to what you would save by waiting for housing prices to bottom out. $7500 is a lot when you are looking at homes that are under $200k, but homes that are twice that? You are going to make a decision to buy based on 1.875% savings from the government when housing prices can still fall 5 10 15 20% or more?
    Nebuchadnezzar
    Admin

    July 31st, 2008 @ 3:20PM

    Registered:
    2003-03-20
    Location:
    Irvine, CA
    Posts: 2884
    Yeah.
    Desler
    Peon

    July 31st, 2008 @ 6:54PM

    Registered:
    2006-10-10
    Location:
    Posts: 93
    The man knows what he wants DoS. Moving on.
    killer6600
    Peon

    August 1st, 2008 @ 2:18AM

    Registered:
    2007-06-16
    Location:
    canada
    Posts: 553
    nebu, if you make more than her now, prenup, simple, straightforward, easy.

    any girl who says that prenups are un trustworthy or whatever are rediculous. any argument someone has against a prenup is an argument agaisnt not signing one.
    Darren
    Red State Cowboy

    August 1st, 2008 @ 2:48PM

    Registered:
    2004-08-30
    Location:
    Dallas, TX
    Posts: 1022
    Wise choice Nebu. Business for us in Texas is horrid right now, and at least we're doing better than in Arizona where I relocated back from after seeing a raging market for several years. It's great to own a home, don't get me wrong, but I hate seeing people lose their ass(ets) on a huge amount of money when they don't completely understand why.

    You made the right choice. The whole housing market is going to collapse pretty soon. Bush signed that POS bailout and it's going to kill values across the country because of the loopholes in it. I've reviewed the points of it and you're looking at a failed piece of legislation that will one day be called a spark of the Depression of 20xx.

    Bankers wanted it only because it would stabilize their books and get crap loans insured by Uncle Sam. It wouldn't surprise me if we truly do see a major depression hit us because we are bailing water out of the boat with a bucket in the middle of a hurricane.

    Save your money, you'll get a smoking deal when you're ready.
    starbabie
    Peon

    August 2nd, 2008 @ 8:25PM

    Registered:
    2003-03-26
    Location:
    USA
    Posts: 53
    Well no one has said this yet. So here goes.

    Do not forget to take a look at your relationship. Sometimes things dont last forever. Child support can take a huge hunk. What if one of you get sick. etc etc. You have to try and prepare for more then a house payment taxes..

    Nebu I only see you on this site but you come across as awsome Father.
    BugNuker
    Special Forces

    August 6th, 2008 @ 1:28PM

    Registered:
    2003-06-09
    Location:
    Posts: 82
    dont get a house next to train! it sucks so bad. you get used to it after a year, but still. what a bitch.
    Ackeron
    Peon

    August 6th, 2008 @ 1:31PM

    Registered:
    2003-03-27
    Location:
    BC, Canada
    Posts: 178
    Agree with Nuker. Living near trains is crap. Especially if they`re required to blow their horns at night or if they`re super loud/long cargo trains.

    I currently live a 10m drive from train tracks, and you can STILL hear the horn going off at night. Shit travels so far!
    bschultz
    Special Forces

    August 6th, 2008 @ 5:43PM

    Registered:
    2003-03-26
    Location:
    Bend, OR
    Posts: 385
    having lived in a house thst was about a block away from some train tracks. its really annoying at first. but you eventually get used to it and dont even notice it after a while. like 2-3 months
    Atlantean
    Peon

    August 6th, 2008 @ 7:03PM

    Registered:
    2003-03-26
    Location:
    Orlando, FL
    Posts: 292
    I 2nd what schultz said... I live next to some train tracks... it`s a RxR spur that takes coal to the local power plant. The train makes a round trip once per day, meaning it passes my house twice. For the first 2-3 months, I woke up to the train at night and was slightly annoyed by it (it`s not on a constant schedule, either). But now, I hardly notice it and forget that it`s there. Sometimes it can have a desirable effect... the tracks near my house are on a long-range plan to be converted to light rail tracks, which would increase property value. But with a kids, it might disturb their sleep.
    Apricoth
    Kali Compton Girl

    August 7th, 2008 @ 4:49AM

    Registered:
    2003-06-14
    Location:
    MN
    Posts: 1739
    I cannot imagine the value of your home being that great down the road being next to train tracks... That is not a desirable. I would almost ask the realtor (or seller) why they are selling their home. The other issue with being near the train tracks is you have young children. Do not settle for it - becareful of this in general. I know you guys are getting tired and are torn between staying where you are and buying a home... Do not settle for less. If you cannot find anything that works for all 4 of you, then just damn wait and renew your lease for another 6 months.
    Charkoth
    Right Wing Extremist

    August 7th, 2008 @ 6:40AM

    Registered:
    2003-05-08
    Location:
    OHIO
    Posts: 1285
    Trains aren`t that bad. I live maybe 2 blocks distance from some tracks that maybe has 5 or 6 passes on any given day and I don`t notice it.

    In california I`m going to guess usually you don`t have your windows down due to having the AC on so you`ll rarely hear the horn.

    The best way to figure out how bad it will be is by sitting around on the property for a day to see if the house shakes etc. My house shakes slightly but I only notice it if I am laying in bed on the second floor and try to feel it.
    ROBOKATZ
    Peon

    August 7th, 2008 @ 7:04AM

    Registered:
    2003-03-25
    Location:
    Gainesville, FL
    Posts: 389
    Trains are LOUD. It will scare the crap out of your kids in the middle of the night.
    meorah
    Peon

    August 7th, 2008 @ 9:08AM

    Registered:
    2003-04-10
    Location:
    Posts: 450
    The $7500 is a 0% interest LOAN over 15 years, not a grant. You have to pay it back just like any other loan.

    And yes, people buying right now when they don`t have a NEED to buy are morons. If you really need a house for the kids, you gotta do what you gotta do.
    FeetOfStinky
    Peon

    August 7th, 2008 @ 11:53AM

    Registered:
    2003-04-09
    Location:
    Austin, TX
    Posts: 8
    DO NOT buy in CA right now. That market is nowhere near its bottom. You could lose 10-20% of your house value in a month when the bubble does pop.

    If you do buy, DO NOT get an ARM or some other form of variable interest loan. Get a 30 year fixed.

    Be careful and DO YOUR RESEARCH. This is a nasty market to be buying in, and you`re in especially risky territory because of your location. If I were you I`d start saving like crazy for a down payment on a future house so you can get decent loan terms when the time does come for you to buy. You will almost certainly be in better shape waiting 1-2 years.

    Don`t let the gvmt incentive sway your decision either. If you feel like you really need that extra cash to make the deal work, you can`t afford the house in the first place.
    Miamihrrcne
    Peon

    August 7th, 2008 @ 3:21PM

    Registered:
    2004-03-12
    Location:
    Miami
    Posts: 669
    i just started reading the book "economics facts and fallacies" by thomas sowell. he has an interesting take on housing prices and supply and demand and some other stuff and then further evidence to show that government tampering with the marketplace is the cause of skyrocketing prices of homes in california and thus this entire foreclosure problem. you should give it a read. there is a lot of evidence to back up his claims, also. basically we are all screwed because a bunch of idiots control everything.
    Slev
    Grunt

    August 7th, 2008 @ 3:57PM

    Registered:
    2003-03-26
    Location:
    Seattle
    Posts: 433
    meorah is right, the $7500 is a loan that must be repaid over 15 years and must be repaid in full when the house is sold if it's sold before 15 years is up. It sounds like you don't think you qualify anyways, but if you do partially qualify, be aware.
    Nebuchadnezzar
    Admin

    August 7th, 2008 @ 4:29PM

    Registered:
    2003-03-20
    Location:
    Irvine, CA
    Posts: 2884
    I just heard about that 7500 LOAN thing yesterday. Thanks!
    Nebuchadnezzar
    Admin

    August 7th, 2008 @ 4:31PM

    Registered:
    2003-03-20
    Location:
    Irvine, CA
    Posts: 2884
    I just heard about that 7500 LOAN thing yesterday. Thanks!

    There's a wall between the train and it went by and I couldn't even hear it with the sliding door open. The homes in the same area are going for 100k more than that home also. I expect the offer to fail anyway.

    The wall does need a little repair though. Some of the bricks are out, maybe someone tried to bust their way in.
    Slippy
    beat junkie

    August 7th, 2008 @ 5:53PM

    Registered:
    2003-03-28
    Location:
    Toronto, Ontario, Canada
    Posts: 333
    Two things:

    1. I was pretty much in your situation only a few months ago. We were looking at a few homes (ranging from $400,000 to $550,000). Both of us have great jobs and we can certainly afford either, but we'd certainly be putting a large sum of our wages into a home every month, and we decided that we don't want the extra risks associated with owning a home right now.

    I'm in Canada, and even here in Ontario, we are certainly feeling the crunch. Housing prices remain very high -- too high in my opinion, and everyone knows that the market will crash very soon. Funny thing is that people are still buying -- left right and centre, but really what are the odds that you will break even on your investment?

    I agree that to make a proper investment, you need to spend 10+ years into it.. but then you also gotta consider location location location. When you look at any home, don't just think of it as a place to live; think about how you are going to sell it. After all, if you are making an investment, you need to figure out now how you plan to make signifigant gains on that investment.

    In other words, a home right next to the railway tracks is probably not the smartest of ideas, considering that few people would want to live next to an eyesore that is, ahem, the railway tracks.

    In the US, the situation is even worse in my opinion. You are seeing housing prices fall, but more because of foreclosures. I noticed you found one area where a whole bunch of homes are foreclosing at the same time. Take my advice: thats probably not a smart area to buy in.

    Any area that you buy a home, where you believe people will lose their jobs in the near future is not a good place to invest. Foreclosures mean that more people will sell, and when more people sell in one area, it makes that area less attractive on an overall whole. It also means that property values in that area will start to go down, as the homeowners themselves start producing less income.

    I'm no financial expert, but I wouldn't buy anything right now in an area where you've got people losing jobs or unable to afford payments. This means that alot of homes will be selling at the same time, and while realtors will tell you that its GOOD to see alot of homes selling in one area at one time, it will actually do just the opposite; buyers will start questioning why so many people are selling at once in the same area.. it starts making the area itself look more questionable and questionable.

    Now of course, I'm not living in the US, so maybe the foreclosure situation is far more widespread, and every area may be affected by this phenomenon. Still, at the end of the day, I think that it is better to wait; like the other comments above, you WILL lose money on that investment. And contrary to popular opinion, it could take a decade before you ever recoup the original value of your home, meaning that if you do decide to live there for 10 years, you may only break even by the time you sell.. this is what happened back in the early 90s in Canada during that resession.

    So my final thoughts: don't buy a home. Renting is insane, I know.. but also consider that whatever you pay initially in a mortgage is actually going towards the interest first, and the principal last; meaning that what you pay on interest early on is actually equivelent to paying rent.. although $2000+ is still alot of cash on rent :(
    Slippy
    beat junkie

    August 7th, 2008 @ 5:56PM

    Registered:
    2003-03-28
    Location:
    Toronto, Ontario, Canada
    Posts: 333
    I forgot about #2:

    Get out of the US!! You'll make far more money elsewhere :P Come to Canada instead.. just don't watch the CBC; i know you hate it :)
    Nebuchadnezzar
    Admin

    August 8th, 2008 @ 3:39PM

    Registered:
    2003-03-20
    Location:
    Irvine, CA
    Posts: 2884
    Rent now has gone from $1920 to $2,000 for a 2 bedroom. The reason all these are going into foclosure is because people are idiots. They bought houses at 500-700k with variable interest rates. So the houses are now dropped 100-200+K making them good deals. They are all being snagged up. It would be different if it was a ghost town where people are moving out. That's never the case with California. You're just seeing people changing from owning to renting because they can't afford it now. Or you're seeing people switching from renting now to owning because the houses are cheaper.

    I plan on living in that house forever as long as I have the job. I never want to leave.

    We might pull our offer on that train track house. There was a house we really loved but it sold before we could make an offer. The deal fell through and the owners are so mad they took it off the market. We're going to try to make a last offer on it. Also we found ANOTHER house that is a short sale but would be worth it if we could get it.

    EDITED: 2008-08-08 15:42:10
    Apricoth
    Kali Compton Girl

    August 8th, 2008 @ 5:50PM

    Registered:
    2003-06-14
    Location:
    MN
    Posts: 1739
    Yay good luck Neb!

    You two should get married - you won't get so screwed over in taxes since you have a little munchkin - you will have two dependents. Unless HotLikeMe is not working either - she would be the third dependent.
    forest_queen
    Dame

    August 11th, 2008 @ 9:27AM

    Registered:
    2003-03-26
    Location:
    WA
    Posts: 1150
    As far as lenders go, you should look into PenFed (Pentagon Federal Credit Union). I first heard about them from Fatwallet.com - they are talked highly of over there. They don't charge an origination fee which saves thousands right off the bat. They also don't charge other document fees or junk fees that other lenders charge. We got a lower rate with them too than any other bank in this area. You don't have to be military to join nor do you need military ties, they tell you how you can join if you aren't affiliated with the government.
    Slev
    Grunt

    August 11th, 2008 @ 10:30AM

    Registered:
    2003-03-26
    Location:
    Seattle
    Posts: 433
    It worries me when people talk about their monthly payment rather than the type of loan they're getting. To go from $3900/month to $3500/month sounds more than just a better interest rate. It sounds like you're getting offered a non standard loan. Interest only? Balloon? Just be careful you're not getting into a type of loan you regret if the housing market continues to fall. I'm a big fan of standard, fix rate loans, especially if you plan on being in the house a really long time. You always know what your monthly payment is going to be, and you always are guaranteed the principal is coming down every month.
    netsavior
    Grunt

    August 11th, 2008 @ 11:03AM

    Registered:
    2003-08-13
    Location:
    Thousand Oaks, CA
    Posts: 271
    third dependent.
    Unless under a certain age, disabled, or in school an adult cannot be your dependent. However married filing jointly can still be nice, even if your partner is a stay at home mom.
    Nebuchadnezzar
    Admin

    August 11th, 2008 @ 1:49PM

    Registered:
    2003-03-20
    Location:
    Irvine, CA
    Posts: 2884
    30 Year Fixed.
    Constrictor
    Grunt

    August 12th, 2008 @ 2:09PM

    Registered:
    2003-06-08
    Location:
    Bridgewater, NJ
    Posts: 116
    This is just my opinion, but IMO if you can't afford 20% down, you shouldn't be buying. Furthermore most people think the housing market will continue to fall. I would wait.
    Slev
    Grunt

    August 12th, 2008 @ 6:29PM

    Registered:
    2003-03-26
    Location:
    Seattle
    Posts: 433
    constrictor, i disagree on the 20% down. Most first time home buyers living anywhere near a coast would have a heck of a time saving up 20%. My wife and I bought our first house well within our means without 20% down. It would have taken us another 4-5 years to save 20%, we didn't really see a reason to wait. Sure, 20% down is nice when you can do it... but not realistic for a lot of people these days, especially people recently out of school
    Nebuchadnezzar
    Admin

    August 13th, 2008 @ 12:34AM

    Registered:
    2003-03-20
    Location:
    Irvine, CA
    Posts: 2884
    20% down is $100,000. It's taken me 11 years to get that in my 401k.
    eliw23
    Grunt

    August 13th, 2008 @ 10:22AM

    Registered:
    2003-03-26
    Location:
    NJ
    Posts: 145
    Since you've been looking at homes, I stumbled across this blog which highlights terrible real estate photo listings:
    Link

    I'm here at work and I was trying not to laugh out loud but some of these almost made me pee my pants.

    Oh and here's a serious link to a great forum site about buying/selling homes:
    Link

    If you do decide to buy a place, the Gardenweb forums have other sections dedicated to gardening, appliances, home decor, painting, etc.
    Darren
    Red State Cowboy

    August 13th, 2008 @ 1:24PM

    Registered:
    2004-08-30
    Location:
    Dallas, TX
    Posts: 1022
    My Congressman sent this over. Worth a look since you are looking at the $7500 incentive.

    "The housing package contains several initiatives that may benefit first time homebuyers and encourage home ownership. The home-buyer credit will provide a tax refund worth up to 10% of a home's purchase price but no more than $7,500. Married individuals filing separately can claim a maximum $3,750 credit. This credit will apply to principal residences purchased on or after April 9, 2008 and before July 1, 2009. This tax consideration will act more like a interest-free loan as taxpayers will be required to repay any amount received under this provision back to the government over 15 years in equal installments. Repayment of this credit will start in the second year after the taxable year the home was purchased. In addition to this first time home-buyer credit, under P.L. 110-289, home owners who claim the standard deduction will receive an additional standard deduction in 2008 for state and local real property taxes, up to $500 and $1,000 for joint filers."

    You must itemize and pay that money back over time. Just in case this was influencing your decision. Check with your tax advisor before you do anything.



    Nebuchadnezzar
    Admin

    August 14th, 2008 @ 10:52AM

    Registered:
    2003-03-20
    Location:
    Irvine, CA
    Posts: 2884
    Thanks for the posts. We read them over.
    nate_orenstam
    Special Forces

    August 14th, 2008 @ 12:48PM

    Registered:
    2003-04-05
    Location:
    Posts: 1166
    This is just my opinion, but IMO if you can't afford 20% down, you shouldn't be buying.

    Why not?

    However, PMI is a rip. If you can't afford 20% down get a second so you don't have to pay it.
    nate_orenstam
    Special Forces

    August 15th, 2008 @ 11:12AM

    Registered:
    2003-04-05
    Location:
    Posts: 1166
    don't get discouraged! i looked at over 100 houses over a period of several months before i bought my first house. i definitely benefited from seeing a lot of different properties and hearing a lot of different sales pitches, and sooner or later you will find a place that you like and isn't surrounded by frantic buyers for one reason or another.

    i ended up buying a place that had a weird 'property only shown with accepted offer' condition on it. my realtor called their realtor and got us in the door and it looked good inside. apparently nobody else had bothered going that far--it had been on the market for six months--and i snagged it at a good price. strange things happen, and when you're in the market you are in a position to take advantage of them.
    Nebuchadnezzar
    Admin

    August 15th, 2008 @ 2:02PM

    Registered:
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    Irvine, CA
    Posts: 2884
    Yeah we've looked at about 20-30 or so.
    Nebuchadnezzar
    Admin

    August 15th, 2008 @ 2:48PM

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    Posts: 2884
    We're going to make a final offer again of 6k closing costs instead of 12k.

    Their last response before that offer has been made was:

    The sellers decided not to accept your offer.. they do appreciate very much that you like their taste and home but at this point they are considering another offer that obviously is better than yours. (use of obviously really pisses me off). If your buyers are still interested you might want to consider offering full price.

    Well I need $$ for closing costs so I can't do that. Especially if they're making us buy a fridge (when they have two).

    nate_orenstam
    Special Forces

    August 15th, 2008 @ 3:53PM

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    The sellers decided not to accept your offer.. they do appreciate very much that you like their taste and home but at this point they are considering another offer that obviously is better than yours. (use of obviously really pisses me off). If your buyers are still interested you might want to consider offering full price.

    as i'm sure you know this might well not be true.

    Especially if they're making us buy a fridge (when they have two).

    this is a house you're talking about, my man. get a fridge for a hundred bucks off craigslist.
    Nebuchadnezzar
    Admin

    August 15th, 2008 @ 9:24PM

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    Posts: 2884
    Yeah we plan on getting crap off craplist.
    Apricoth
    Kali Compton Girl

    August 16th, 2008 @ 8:20PM

    Registered:
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    Location:
    MN
    Posts: 1739
    My husband and I did not do 20% or even 30% down pymt on our current home. We are doing fine and we are happy. Although a few years down the road we plan on moving into a new home. This one is getting small fast.
    dmikon
    Peon

    August 17th, 2008 @ 9:33AM

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    USA
    Posts: 351
    I would wait a little longer if I were you guys. The housing market has not recovered yet, and if for some reason you will need to sell the house in the near future, even a small percentage drop in the price can be fairly bad on a $450,000 house, especially with a low down payment.
    Nebuchadnezzar
    Admin

    August 18th, 2008 @ 4:15PM

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    People are guessing interest rates are going up so if the price of the house goes down, it doesn't matter.
    Desler
    Peon

    August 19th, 2008 @ 11:20AM

    Registered:
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    Posts: 93
    I hope you trust your real estate agent to submit all your bids. Some agents get lazy and just won`t submit bids if they think they are too low, which possibly might explain the train track house.
    Nebuchadnezzar
    Admin

    August 19th, 2008 @ 11:25AM

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    Posts: 2884
    Well she's a friend. I've known her for like 3-4 years prior to being a broker.
    Bashkir
    Peon

    August 20th, 2008 @ 4:43PM

    Registered:
    2003-04-30
    Location:
    Alexandria, VA
    Posts: 128
    I would recommend that, if you find a good deal, then take it and be happy with it. You have a stable job and it appears that HotLikeMe does, too, so you aren`t in any of the danger of having to give up your place up any time soon. I would make sure that you get a place that you`ll be happy in for quite a while (i.e. big enough for the family that you envision).

    What many of these people forget to mention is that real estate is one of the better investments that you can make long term. This is especially true when you`re talking about buying at a non-peak time like now. It also helps that California has a housing market that is absolutely nuts and that probably won`t change any time in the near future.

    What I wouldn`t do is to go out and really push to get a place. Be patient and find the right place at the right price. You will be much happier. If you don`t find it, then try to stick to a short lease or even try to find somewhere that you can live month to month, so that you`re able to jump at an opportunity when it presents itself.

    Also, I would look into loans and that type of thing as well (if you haven`t already). There are incentives for first time home buyers that you`ve mentioned as well as incentives that will give you better mortgage rates.

    Remember that, the sooner you start paying your mortgage off, the less time you`ll have left to pay it off. Also, by renting, you`re only delaying this process and sort of throwing your money away. I`ve been told and found it to be true that you should stretch a little bit for your mortgage. It will seem like a large payment at first, but, with inflation and raises and such, it won`t be a big deal to you before long and you`ll be happier that you got the better place.
    Nebuchadnezzar
    Admin

    August 20th, 2008 @ 5:54PM

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    Posts: 2884
    Taking care of kids and going to Disneyland is a job?
    ROBOKATZ
    Peon

    August 21st, 2008 @ 4:51AM

    Registered:
    2003-03-25
    Location:
    Gainesville, FL
    Posts: 389
    Here`s to ditching cable. They offered me the basic service for $5/mo when I called to cancel completely, so I took that, combined with the netflix 4-at-time plan, and I haven`t regretted it at all.
    Apricoth
    Kali Compton Girl

    August 24th, 2008 @ 6:28AM

    Registered:
    2003-06-14
    Location:
    MN
    Posts: 1739
    Nebu - haha Even some jobs can be fun. Being a parent is your other job. I would say much more rewarding then the job that pays you to help you live and carry on your parent job more successfully.
    granther
    Peon

    August 24th, 2008 @ 1:44PM

    Registered:
    2003-04-02
    Location:
    Posts: 129
    you wanna talk about ludicrous housing prices?

    Link
    ROBOKATZ
    Peon

    August 25th, 2008 @ 6:39AM

    Registered:
    2003-03-25
    Location:
    Gainesville, FL
    Posts: 389
    Amazingly they are selling crappy little condos downtown here for the same amount. And if you can stand to live 10 minutes away from downtown you can get that 1.7M house posted earlier for about 400k. The south floridians make the housing market here really weird.
    Morpheus
    Kali Compton

    August 25th, 2008 @ 9:39AM

    Registered:
    2003-03-25
    Location:
    Vienna, Virginia
    Posts: 156
    Be very careful about real estate agents making you feel like you're getting caught up in a bidding war. The fact is, while sales may be creeping up, sale prices are generally going down still (foreclosures aside).

    One of the most common tactics real estate agents will pull is the phantom better offer. Both agents make more money if the buyer pays more so it is in both of their interests to get as much as they can for the house.

    If the house sits there, then they most likely lied about the other offer. Seriously though, real estate agents are sharks and when they smell blood, they'll attack. Don't show any weakness about your offer whatsoever.

    Also, be sure you don't fall for the trap of "this house is listed at X, but it's really worth $100K more. If that were so, they would've already sold it. The house is only worth what someone is willing to pay for it.

    Just be very careful about letting your frustration get to you and ramping up your offers. The numbers still indicate a depressed housing market, and most of the houses that are moving are foreclosures. The market won't bounce back up sharply when it does recover. So even if you don't get in at the absolute bottom, it's okay. Don't let the realtors sway you into thinking prices are going up like they were between 2002 and late 2005. And who cares what the house was worth in late 2005 anyways. It's not worth that now, right?

    Good luck!
    nate_orenstam
    Special Forces

    August 29th, 2008 @ 9:25PM

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    Posts: 1166
    Nebu, congratulations (with contingencies on those congratulations of course)! I think you will enjoy not sharing walls with potential assjacks.
    legendofxix
    Peon

    August 29th, 2008 @ 9:29PM

    Registered:
    2006-04-16
    Location:
    Posts: 101
    Congrats.
    Now instead of sharing walls with those potential assjacks, you will be sharing an entire block.
    BiVRiP
    Grunt

    August 29th, 2008 @ 10:49PM

    Registered:
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    Location:
    Ontario, Canada
    Posts: 1487
    Congrats. Hope the inspections come out in your favour.
    Desler
    Peon

    August 30th, 2008 @ 7:55AM

    Registered:
    2006-10-10
    Location:
    Posts: 93
    Whew, I was just helping a friend who bought a house fix up his house yesterday - what a bunch of work. Don`t underestimate the amount of work it takes to fix some things up if you are doing it yourself. On the plus side though, he still seems very happy to do the work, it is after all his house now.
    BlueFalcon
    Word To Your Mom

    August 30th, 2008 @ 4:34PM

    Registered:
    2003-04-27
    Location:
    Filth-a-delphia
    Posts: 1029
    I just got back from some training and saw that you were about to jump into some deep water. I'm happy to see you stuck your toe in first to check the current.

    I'm telling you man, you're better off waiting. Paying rent sucks, but having a house payment on a property that could continue to lose value is even worse.

    From the sounds of your financing, you may be better off by re-adjusting your sights about $30-50k lower (in terms of what you're willing to pay for a house). Given that the market could still shed another 15-20%, you can get houses that you are looking at today for $50k less in 12-18 months. You don't want to eat up all your savings and be stuck making a monthly payment that consumes a huge part of your net earnings.
    killer6600
    Peon

    August 30th, 2008 @ 8:45PM

    Registered:
    2007-06-16
    Location:
    canada
    Posts: 553
    so did you buy the house? or stop buying it cause closing costs are retarded?
    meorah
    Peon

    August 31st, 2008 @ 1:51AM

    Registered:
    2003-04-10
    Location:
    Posts: 450
    You can`t really have it all and you should consider leaving your company for ANYWHERE else that would probably get you at least a 25% raise, especially with your resume. Your company should be in the position that they`re lucky to have you, and not vice versa.

    And just negotiate the sellers to pay like half the negotiating costs and roll the other half into your mortgage.

    Also, negotiate repair costs off the sell price if you really don`t have the money to do them yourself. You might actually come out ahead if you do the easy repairs yourself from Home Depot or Lowe`s over a few weekends and let the pros do the big repairs.

    And if your realtor hasn`t already suggested this stuff, find another one.
    redgeopower
    Peon

    August 31st, 2008 @ 7:55AM

    Registered:
    2003-08-24
    Location:
    OR USA
    Posts: 133
    Stick you your guns or you will get screwed.

    The `walk-away` is your ultimate weapon when your making large financial deals. I`ve employed it with great success and only once have I had the deal completely lost.

    I would not be suprise if they call you back with a new deal, or sometimes even the agents pay the fees.
    BiVRiP
    Grunt

    September 2nd, 2008 @ 1:26AM

    Registered:
    2003-05-11
    Location:
    Ontario, Canada
    Posts: 1487
    "You can`t really have it all and you should consider leaving your company for ANYWHERE else that would probably get you at least a 25% raise, especially with your resume."

    This may sound fine in principle, but in reality it's not as clear-cut as that. Money isn't everything; there's a lot to be said about the value of one's happiness. If you ask ten random people to list their top 5 grievences, I bet that "I don't like my job" would rank highly on everyone's list.

    Sure Nebu could likely get a higher paying job elsewhere, but at what price? Let's say he gets a 25% bump in income by going to company xyz. Here a few downsides he can expect by changing employers:

    * Starting from scratch - He's been at Blizzard for a little more than 10 years now. That's 10 years of relationships cultivated between fellow co-workers in various departments and likely some connections with middle/upper management. Going to another company means having to start that process all over again; earning peoples trust and making a name for yourself. You're socially and professionally at the bottom of the company's totem pole.

    * Company perks - From what Nebu has shared with us over the years, working at Blizzard sounds like a dream job. In all likelihood, I bet he wouldn't be able to do half the stuff he's presently allowed to do. He certainly wouldn't have the access he enjoys now.

    * Job Security - Let's face it, now that Nebu has a family to look after, he wants to have some reasonable assurances that he won't be let go in the foreseeable future. Can you think of another game developer that is as stable and prosperous as Blizzard?

    * Health - Granted Nebu doesn't seem to have the best of luck when it comes to health, but how much more complicated would his life be if he had to deal with the added stress/anger of working job he doesn't enjoy?

    * Reputation - I bet even after all these years Nebu still gets a kick out of seeing peoples faces when he tells them he works for Blizzard. How many of us wouldn't give an arm or a leg to be in his place?

    I'm not saying changing jobs simply for the money should never be done, only that as you get older you have to re-evaluate what's important to you and appreciate what you have to gain/lose by changing jobs.
    Charkoth
    Right Wing Extremist

    September 2nd, 2008 @ 8:40AM

    Registered:
    2003-05-08
    Location:
    OHIO
    Posts: 1285
    Nebu you are making a mistake man, now is not the time.
    meorah
    Peon

    September 2nd, 2008 @ 8:55AM

    Registered:
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    Posts: 450
    BiV, that`s all well and good, but he`s asking how to buy a house, and I`m suggesting he trade-off job perks and work complacency for the additional hassle of home ownership.

    Personally, I don`t really want to own a home because I want many of the things you listed. But you gotta make sacrifices to buy a home.
    Nebuchadnezzar
    Admin

    September 2nd, 2008 @ 2:14PM

    Registered:
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    Irvine, CA
    Posts: 2884
    The only way it's a mistake is if my partner can't help on the rent.

    Otherwise it's great until I'm forclosed on, then the cycle repeats!
    Charkoth
    Right Wing Extremist

    September 4th, 2008 @ 10:52AM

    Registered:
    2003-05-08
    Location:
    OHIO
    Posts: 1285
    Glad you came to the right decision in the end. I was wondering given our similar fields how in God's name you could afford a 350k+ house with God knows how much property taxes. You'd have to be bringing in almost 6 figures I'd think if you had any other debt/bills.

    Wait it out another 2 years Nebu you wont be sorry.
    Constrictor
    Grunt

    September 4th, 2008 @ 1:22PM

    Registered:
    2003-06-08
    Location:
    Bridgewater, NJ
    Posts: 116
    @Charkoth

    Six figures on the dot won't even cut it at a $4000.00 per month payment.

    My house is $3500 / month and both my wife and I work and have good paying jobs. I can't imagine paying 4k a month on a single salary unless you're a big earner like an executive.
    Enforcerman
    Kali Compton

    September 4th, 2008 @ 2:26PM

    Registered:
    2003-03-26
    Location:
    SCL Headquarters - Texas Division
    Posts: 265
    It's hard to give up the party!
    Charkoth
    Right Wing Extremist

    September 5th, 2008 @ 8:37AM

    Registered:
    2003-05-08
    Location:
    OHIO
    Posts: 1285
    4K a month if property taxes are included is doable with 100k i'd think with Nebu's lifestyle.

    I think home prices are the major component of the expensive lifestyle in California. Hell last time I took a business trip to Cali Starbucks was cheaper! )=

    2/3 of his income is going into his home at 100k, but as long as they both aren't driving beamers and eating out every night the other 25K should cover the rest.





    meorah
    Peon

    September 7th, 2008 @ 10:00PM

    Registered:
    2003-04-10
    Location:
    Posts: 450
    "Sure Nebu could likely get a higher paying job elsewhere, but at what price?"

    Well, for starters, the ability to buy a house that costs less than 40% of his monthly income for mortgage, insurance, and maintenance.

    Then there`s the self-confidence that comes from having the means to give his family what they want instead of trying every avenue possible and still not finding a solution.

    And finally, a real man would say the perks you listed are all fickle except for job security, but you`re basing his security off his sector experience instead of his skillset. Highly skilled web designers with 10+ years of experience get paid handsomely in just about every single market sector, and any fortune 500 with a web marketing/advertising/merchandising department want someone to execute their ideas and give knowledgable feedback on what`s possible, what looks good, what methods to use, and the ability to do it. That doesn`t even start to include the thousands of ecommerce sites who are trying desperately to differentiate themselves without having to drop their prices even lower.

    But it`s probably better he doesn`t consider the well-being of his girl and 2 kids so he can keep his e-reputation, save himself a little anxiety in switching jobs after a decade, and get to keep his sword and shield.

    Charkoth, 2/3 of income going into a house definitely ranks top 10 in stupidest things to do with your money, regardless of cars or restaurants. 25K to house/feed/clothe/insure/etc 4 people in SoCal? Hope his car and computer and W/D and central air and plumbing never breaks, his kids never have a cavity, he never has a medical emergency, and he never wants to buy another movie/mp3/game system again for the next 30 years.
    supervillain
    Grunt

    September 9th, 2008 @ 3:10PM

    Registered:
    2003-03-25
    Location:
    socal
    Posts: 154
    It is unfortunate that you are unable to purchase a home now but it is completely understandable that hotlikeme would not like to work. She has an 8 month old to take care of.

    Here is a pretty good article on the financial pros and cons of buying vs renting. The example they give is rather long but I think it is convincing.
    Darren
    Red State Cowboy

    September 9th, 2008 @ 3:42PM

    Registered:
    2004-08-30
    Location:
    Dallas, TX
    Posts: 1022
    Good choice Nebu. I was wondering if you were still pursuing this deal. Save for down and live on rice n beans for a year. Buy it then. Too many people just go out and buy something because that's what they hear they should do. Don't join the idiots I work with on a daily basis that buy with little down payment and no idea what they are going to get themselves into. Be smart about it.
    DarkShear
    Peon

    October 24th, 2008 @ 2:51AM

    Registered:
    2003-04-22
    Location:
    Seattle
    Posts: 608
    Haha - wutz dis housis ken go dewn?

    I hope you score this one, then you can post awesome pics of your remodeling jobs n such! :)
    NinjaCrusader
    Peon

    November 20th, 2008 @ 8:58PM

    Registered:
    2004-06-24
    Location:
    Illinois
    Posts: 97
    some lenders have started leaning on mortgage agents and offering a `conditional commissions` incentive.

    so knowing that, agents are being more careful, especially in the socal area, to make sure they sell to people who can really pay.

    my advice: pretend you two are actually married when you go look at a house and they might be more prone to believe you`ll be able to finish the mortgage
    Apricoth
    Kali Compton Girl

    November 21st, 2008 @ 4:32AM

    Registered:
    2003-06-14
    Location:
    MN
    Posts: 1739
    Ninja has a good point. Married couples represent financial stability, emotionally stability to other people, regardless if that is true or not. Although my husband and I did not have any issues getting a home before we were married.. On the other hand, we were using our bosses realtor. heh Maybe you should ask your boss if he/she has a realtor he/she would recommend.
    Signum666
    Grunt

    December 19th, 2008 @ 1:50AM

    Registered:
    2003-10-27
    Location:
    Netherlands
    Posts: 432
    Sounds great Nebu! Be sure to post some pics of the house. I'm curious about how it looks.
    Zelph01
    Peon

    December 22nd, 2008 @ 9:45AM

    Registered:
    2005-06-20
    Location:
    Posts: 486
    Interest rate 4.5%

    http://www.fatwallet.com/forums/finance/881743/

    If you`re paying over 5%, either your credit score sucks or you haven`t looked around for a better deal.
    Nebuchadnezzar
    Admin

    December 22nd, 2008 @ 10:29AM

    Registered:
    2003-03-20
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    Irvine, CA
    Posts: 2884
    We have to Do FHA.
    osiris
    Grunt

    December 23rd, 2008 @ 4:55AM

    Registered:
    2003-04-04
    Location:
    PA
    Posts: 316
    I just bought a house last month. We did FHA, and boy the paperwork they wanted was insane. We went through a mortgage broker, not a bank. You might want to look into that route. Our agent said that starting in January the FHA rules are changing. The minimum down payment was increasing to 3.5%, and the maximum amount you can now ask the seller to pay in closing costs will be 3%.

    I got lucky, I got my house for 10k less than the listed price and I got the seller to pay all of the closing costs. But I'm in a MUCH different market than you (Western PA).

    Also FHA is extremely picky about the shape of the house. They will do a separate inspection and give you a list of things that will need repaired before the loan can be approved. For my house they required chipped paint to be removed and repainted, hand rails on all steps (inside and out). All windows must be able to open. They even wanted the old TV antenna disconnected in the attic. We had to work out the details with the seller, on who would pay for the repairs. We ended up splitting the cost.

    Good luck with the house, expect a month of ups and downs with the loan process. It will be one of the most stressful months of your life :)

    EDITED: 2008-12-23 05:02:02
    Apricoth
    Kali Compton Girl

    December 23rd, 2008 @ 9:13AM

    Registered:
    2003-06-14
    Location:
    MN
    Posts: 1739
    I am sure glad we did not have months of loan process issues. We had our house built, everything lined up, papers signed and off we went.
    Slev
    Grunt

    December 23rd, 2008 @ 9:50AM

    Registered:
    2003-03-26
    Location:
    Seattle
    Posts: 433
    We used a broker to find our lender, but our loan ended up getting sold to Wells Fargo... no problems as far as ongoing payments go with them. Can't comment on actual closing process though.
    Nebuchadnezzar
    Admin

    December 24th, 2008 @ 5:38PM

    Registered:
    2003-03-20
    Location:
    Irvine, CA
    Posts: 2884
    Some really fishy stuff going on.

    The seller wanted us to go with our original lender or claimed they were backing out. I don't know if they can even do that. They wanted the 4 other offers on their house.

    dmikon
    Peon

    December 24th, 2008 @ 8:23PM

    Registered:
    2004-11-05
    Location:
    USA
    Posts: 351
    Maybe they received better offers after accepting yours and are now trying to pull any string possible to kill the deal?
    Nebuchadnezzar
    Admin

    December 25th, 2008 @ 1:44AM

    Registered:
    2003-03-20
    Location:
    Irvine, CA
    Posts: 2884
    Yeah they did say they got 4 other good offers.
    Apricoth
    Kali Compton Girl

    December 25th, 2008 @ 9:26PM

    Registered:
    2003-06-14
    Location:
    MN
    Posts: 1739
    Well, that's too bad for the seller, isn't it? I mean, if they agreed to your price without waiting for the other offers to come in - boo hoo.
    forest_queen
    Dame

    December 26th, 2008 @ 9:12AM

    Registered:
    2003-03-26
    Location:
    WA
    Posts: 1150
    Hmmm, do you have a real estate lawyer working for you? I would get representation just in case.
    Apricoth
    Kali Compton Girl

    January 5th, 2009 @ 7:29AM

    Registered:
    2003-06-14
    Location:
    MN
    Posts: 1739
    Sounds irritating that the seller keeps showing it off like that. Is loan for certain? I have heard of housing deals falling through up to the last minute when the lender declines the loan - anything can do that, like too many credit cards accepted, huge credit card purchases, etc. Just be aware of that. No purchases until you get that house in your hands.
    Slippy
    beat junkie

    January 5th, 2009 @ 6:39PM

    Registered:
    2003-03-28
    Location:
    Toronto, Ontario, Canada
    Posts: 333
    Wow.. I never thought I'd say this Nebu, but it looks like I am officially in the market for a house.

    I had originally considered renting, as I still felt that the house prices will come down in 2008/2009 -- incidently, I still believe they will come down in '09.. more on that later. To cut it short: We weren't able to find a decent rental property; almost everything we found had super-sketchy tenants.. basically my fiancee would have never left the apt. if I weren't there. Thus, began the search for a home.

    I am currently looking for a place in a small town in Ontario that is halfway between mine and my fiancee's jobs. I've been checking the recent MLS sales for this area, and shockingly the homes are selling fast, very similarily to what you describe as happening in your area.

    I am planning on making an offer on a house as soon as Wednesday; I think we have finally found what we have been searching for. It is interesting when I discuss this purchase with my co-workers.. I've met many who support that this is a buyers market and a great time to buy a house, while others have told me that this is the worst time and that I need to wait another year.. some analysts still say that house prices will fall as much as 10% by the end of 2009..

    We are getting married in May, and we must finalize our living situation by that point. Because of the location of our two jobs (very far apart from one another), we have limited options to where we can live comfortably, and this house seems to fit exactly our needs and our comfort levels; it is also the best house I've seen hands down in the area.. so as you can see, this is a tough call to make.

    I hope everything goes well with your purchase, and that you are completely satisfied with your new home!

    EDITED: 2009-01-05 18:42:31
    GroverDill
    Special Forces

    January 13th, 2009 @ 1:47PM

    Registered:
    2003-04-09
    Location:
    your mom's house
    Posts: 622
    Already thinking about about adding a second story? BALLING!
    Nebuchadnezzar
    Admin

    January 13th, 2009 @ 3:34PM

    Registered:
    2003-03-20
    Location:
    Irvine, CA
    Posts: 2884
    It's a good time to buy because the interest rates are historically low. They hit as low as 4.6% the other day for conventional loans.
    Miamihrrcne
    Peon

    January 13th, 2009 @ 6:08PM

    Registered:
    2004-03-12
    Location:
    Miami
    Posts: 669
    HOAs are a disgrace to freedom...and frankly, unamerican.
    Nebuchadnezzar
    Admin

    January 13th, 2009 @ 7:02PM

    Registered:
    2003-03-20
    Location:
    Irvine, CA
    Posts: 2884
    I agree.
    hardcore puppy
    Peon

    January 14th, 2009 @ 1:31PM

    Registered:
    2003-11-02
    Location:
    Irvine, CA
    Posts: 140
    HOAs maybe the devil, but without them, think of the dump that your neighborhood COULD turn into. When I worked at a HOA company in Irvine, they charged residents extra monthly to fix what damage the fire in `08 caused, but if they hadn`t, I`d imagine people living next to a burnt hill for the next 5 years in what was considered a nice neighborhood.
    Apricoth
    Kali Compton Girl

    January 16th, 2009 @ 4:09PM

    Registered:
    2003-06-14
    Location:
    MN
    Posts: 1739
    What the heck? Who is ordering another appraisal? Wow, glad we didn't have to go through that.
    Darren
    Red State Cowboy

    January 21st, 2009 @ 3:11PM

    Registered:
    2004-08-30
    Location:
    Dallas, TX
    Posts: 1022
    Well little late on the reply, but this is standard nowadays, especially in high risk states like anything on the West Coast. Your values are declining and I'm having problems getting most things closed even here in Texas where our values have remained somewhat stable.

    I'd urge you to go with the flow, the banks are definitely not using the bailout money to lend to anyone. That's just the state of the industry nationwide. Sorry, but blame the stupid Aholes that decided that negative amortization loans were the best things since sliced bread!
    fupbro
    Peon

    January 27th, 2009 @ 5:00PM

    Registered:
    2005-01-22
    Location:
    Portland, OR
    Posts: 71
    Just call the police and tell them there`s strangers living in your new house.
    hardcore puppy
    Peon

    January 27th, 2009 @ 5:52PM

    Registered:
    2003-11-02
    Location:
    Irvine, CA
    Posts: 140
    Since it`s their fault, can`t you either charge them rent for staying there, get reimbursed for the rent of your apt, or some money back for the hassle you`re going through? Doesn`t seem fair if you guys had an agreement and they are constantly pushing the date back.
    eliw23
    Grunt

    January 27th, 2009 @ 9:28PM

    Registered:
    2003-03-26
    Location:
    NJ
    Posts: 145
    That's strange about all the delays with the lender. I remember having solid dates on the contracts I signed which stated when we could move in. Did they say the cause of the delays? Are you using a real estate attorney? Probably a little too late to use one in your case but if you ever do move again, I think it'd be a big help especially during situations like this. I was selling and purchasing at the same time and we closed on both the same day so move in/out dates were crucial.
    Nebuchadnezzar
    Admin

    January 28th, 2009 @ 3:03AM

    Registered:
    2003-03-20
    Location:
    Irvine, CA
    Posts: 2884
    They've missed two dates already. The first time we were to close on the 19th but the problem was with the seller who had to own the house for 90 days. The next prob we don't know.

    We signed the papers on FRIDAY and he didn't turn them in until MONDAY (suspicious). We even did them early in the day like 11 a.m.
    Apricoth
    Kali Compton Girl

    January 28th, 2009 @ 4:47AM

    Registered:
    2003-06-14
    Location:
    MN
    Posts: 1739
    That is very odd. What bank are you getting your mortgage loan through? I would speak to the superviser/manager or something. that is pretty unacceptable. On our house we never had stupid delays like that. It was clean, cut and dry.
    osiris
    Grunt

    January 28th, 2009 @ 4:58AM

    Registered:
    2003-04-04
    Location:
    PA
    Posts: 316
    I have never heard of anything like this. As soon as you sign those closing papers, that house is yours. See a lawyer ASAP, something is very wrong.
    covact
    Baron

    January 29th, 2009 @ 8:15AM

    Registered:
    2003-03-26
    Location:
    The World
    Posts: 214
    Wow you have to be making this up, Is this a Joke? Wow I have boughten several houses in several states and have never NEVER had anything like this. Rent your house??? Something is amiss or mis-understood! Yes You need a Lawyer. I dont even know what you would say or how you would address it but this has been way to painful for you. They should be kissing your ass. Your the one paying.
    Smokin Joe
    Grunt

    January 29th, 2009 @ 10:00AM

    Registered:
    2006-06-10
    Location:
    The Land of Chocolate
    Posts: 1573
    unless you signed something that they snook by you, there is NO way you should let someone else rent your house.

    I mean, think about it.

    If anything, you could swoop in and make some money offa it by trouncing the agent and getting the renters to pay you.

    But unless there`s some fancy contract work, there is NO way you should let this happen. I don`t want to assume the renters are asshats, or the agency is TRYING to screw you - but I`d hate to hear how something doesn`t work right, and it could be because the renters, and since you already signed the papers it`s your problem to deal with.


    Zelph01
    Peon

    January 30th, 2009 @ 7:52AM

    Registered:
    2005-06-20
    Location:
    Posts: 486
    Korean neighbors eh?




    l2eatkimchee.
    DeuceOfSpades
    Kali Compton

    January 30th, 2009 @ 11:14AM

    Registered:
    2003-04-12
    Location:
    Posts: 2981
    Congratulations on finally moving into your very first house :)
    DarkShear
    Peon

    January 31st, 2009 @ 3:18PM

    Registered:
    2003-04-22
    Location:
    Seattle
    Posts: 608
    Rented your house? What the hell...

    Your experience through this whole process has been amazingly shitty.
    Smokin Joe
    Grunt

    February 1st, 2009 @ 10:26AM

    Registered:
    2006-06-10
    Location:
    The Land of Chocolate
    Posts: 1573
    Congrats nebu!

    To think I`ve been reading your sites since you`ve been in Andrews - to now see you get your (first) house. Congrats man, you`re all grown up now!

    Whats the max lockdowns you get? I got a GM Carpenter if you need any furniture.

    hardcore puppy
    Peon

    February 2nd, 2009 @ 3:10PM

    Registered:
    2003-11-02
    Location:
    Irvine, CA
    Posts: 140
    They converted a 2 bedroom into a 3 bedroom using a Den. They never put a vent in that bedroom (baby`s room) and the damn door doesn`t even close because it doesn`t fit. We need to fix the door.

    isnt 3 rooms instead of 2 a pro? It may need some fixing, but in the long term, each child has their individual room.
    Nebuchadnezzar
    Admin

    February 2nd, 2009 @ 4:25PM

    Registered:
    2003-03-20
    Location:
    Irvine, CA
    Posts: 2884
    Yes it's a pro and why we bought. The con is the no vent and the door doesn't close.
    Signum666
    Grunt

    February 3rd, 2009 @ 8:10AM

    Registered:
    2003-10-27
    Location:
    Netherlands
    Posts: 432
    If you're going to fix the door place a vent in it. It's not that hard to do. Just get a jig saw and cut a hole in the door so you can fit in the vent.
    Moosehead
    Peon

    February 3rd, 2009 @ 5:32PM

    Registered:
    2003-03-27
    Location:
    Canada
    Posts: 221
    Re: sun in the gargage... I think the sunrise/set position would move a bit throughout the year? but I don`t totally understand
    GroverDill
    Special Forces

    February 3rd, 2009 @ 5:33PM

    Registered:
    2003-04-09
    Location:
    your mom's house
    Posts: 622
    If you're going to fix the door place a vent in it. It's not that hard to do. Just get a jig saw and cut a hole in the door so you can fit in the vent.

    Ew. Cutting a vent into a door doesn't seem like a real good solution to this problem. Please don't do that.
    DarkShear
    Peon

    February 3rd, 2009 @ 7:36PM

    Registered:
    2003-04-22
    Location:
    Seattle
    Posts: 608
    Smokin Joe made an Ultima Online reference. Holla 1998~!
    Nebuchadnezzar
    Admin

    February 3rd, 2009 @ 11:16PM

    Registered:
    2003-03-20
    Location:
    Irvine, CA
    Posts: 2884
    Why would I put a vent in a door? I'm going to fix the door (or we since I suck at everything) and then someday we may put a vent in.
    Signum666
    Grunt

    February 4th, 2009 @ 1:16AM

    Registered:
    2003-10-27
    Location:
    Netherlands
    Posts: 432
    Because it will provide some ventilation to the room. There are small vent's you could use.
    eliw23
    Grunt

    February 4th, 2009 @ 6:42AM

    Registered:
    2003-03-26
    Location:
    NJ
    Posts: 145
    Is there a window in the bedroom? If not, is the room up to code? It almost sounds like a glorified walk in closet.
    Nebuchadnezzar
    Admin

    February 4th, 2009 @ 1:31PM

    Registered:
    2003-03-20
    Location:
    Irvine, CA
    Posts: 2884
    Yeah there's a window. I don't think the mod is up to code.
    Apricoth
    Kali Compton Girl

    February 5th, 2009 @ 3:21PM

    Registered:
    2003-06-14
    Location:
    MN
    Posts: 1739
    This is really bizarre. I have never heard of this happenign before. Sheesh.
    Disgruntled
    Ottawa Senators

    February 5th, 2009 @ 4:05PM

    Registered:
    2003-05-08
    Location:
    Ottawa, Ontario
    Posts: 159
    I'm pretty sure that I am the most unlucky person in the world. First Hodgkin's cancer (STAGE 4), remission for 10 months, proceed to bone marrow transplant but my marrow doesn't produce enough stem cells to do the safer version (5% chance). So I get an unrelated donor which grafts well for 75 days then it suddenly fails completely (0.1% chance). Donor comes in again and am currently day +62 with this graft.

    Just to put things in perspective.
    RowdyRoddyPiper
    Nut Job

    February 5th, 2009 @ 4:46PM

    Registered:
    2003-06-20
    Location:
    Nashville TN
    Posts: 1018
    dont get too depressed nebu. too much focus is put on fancy trinkets, baubles, fancy cars big houses. but in the end they mean nothing you got a girl that loves you and a wonderful child. survival and living is what matters most. some hard times are in store for every one of us. the great tribulation is happening. nobody in the entire world can escape it but we can endure. everyone needs to watch some youtube vids on the great depression and listen to these old folks on how it was and how they survived. because it is inevitible. anyone right now paying a mortgage you will foreclose sooner or later. the economy is grinding to a halt, pensions stolen, retirement plans called off. california is soon to stop welfare payments. expect massive rioting. here in TN they are running out of funds for unemployment. its all gonna come to a boiling point. get ready for mad max and struggling to find a can of beans. just massive carnage and crime is going to burst at any time.
    Nebuchadnezzar
    Admin

    February 5th, 2009 @ 9:16PM

    Registered:
    2003-03-20
    Location:
    Irvine, CA
    Posts: 2884
    Good luck, Disgruntled :(
    Apricoth
    Kali Compton Girl

    February 6th, 2009 @ 4:40AM

    Registered:
    2003-06-14
    Location:
    MN
    Posts: 1739
    Someone mentioned getting a lawyer. I would right now Neb. This is unnacceptable behavior on the part of the bank.

    And yes, hard times will come upon us all. doesn't mean Neb shoud stand there and let it walk all over him. Bad times = learning experience = building character. If he just stands there saying, "Well shit happens, just the way it goes" then he is not learning anything constructive and he is not protecting his family as well as he is capable of doing.
    osiris
    Grunt

    February 6th, 2009 @ 4:49AM

    Registered:
    2003-04-04
    Location:
    PA
    Posts: 316
    It sucks you are having the rug pulled out from under you. I hope things turn out in the end. I have never heard of something like this.

    Best of luck.
    eliw23
    Grunt

    February 6th, 2009 @ 7:03AM

    Registered:
    2003-03-26
    Location:
    NJ
    Posts: 145
    Yes, please get a real estate attorney. I think I paid 1K but it's worth it in the end. Everything goes through them. They deal with the lender, title company, seller's, etc. and they know the real estate law inside and out. Instead of waiting to see what happens next, you should contact an attorney ASAP. You mentioned signing closing papers. What exactly did you sign? Maybe they're taking advantage of you since they know they don't have to deal with a lawyer. Once you add one to the mix, maybe they'll start acting differently.
    radvan
    Special Forces

    February 6th, 2009 @ 8:32AM

    Registered:
    2003-03-26
    Location:
    Brooklyn, NY
    Posts: 250
    qq more nebu ;)
    shark180
    Liberal hater

    February 8th, 2009 @ 7:07PM

    Registered:
    2004-01-25
    Location:
    MI
    Posts: 955
    I would get a door remote that you program...its real easy to do, saves money as well...
    Zelph01
    Peon

    March 11th, 2009 @ 8:27AM

    Registered:
    2005-06-20
    Location:
    Posts: 486
    Don`t get a remote doorbell- just put in a few more minutes of work and install a wired doorbell. You`ll need a drill with a fine bit that can go through drywall and/or brick for the front door frame.

    Remote doorbells require you to change the batteries- that sucks and you`ll always have a doorbell that works if it`s wired.
    Nebuchadnezzar
    Admin

    March 11th, 2009 @ 10:07AM

    Registered:
    2003-03-20
    Location:
    Irvine, CA
    Posts: 2884
    The gate is not attached to the house so a remote doorbell is the only option. It's a really weird design. The front door is buried on a patio that's accessed by gates on either side of it.


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